Continuing the discussion from About the Music Theory and Composition category:
Sad and a bit confused about what has happened here. Part of the “remodel” and rebranding to Glitch Pulse I suppose.
I didn’t come here often but it was a Topic that I had some interest in and input to share.
Maybe nobody cares about Theory anymore, now that anyone with a phone can make joyful noise at full abandon
I think it became a thread in the studio section
Also it looks like music theory will a be a part of the knowledge base section of the forum
Sadly, yeah. That’s where we’re at as a society right now. My thoughts are unrelated to the state of where the thread might be, but it’s true nonetheless.
When that changes, I think it’ll be front-row and center again, but I’ve noticed a lack of discussions about things like this pretty much everywhere lately. It’s like nobody’s actively studying any of it
Hey @1roomstudio. Thanks for inquiring about this.
For clarity around the knowledge base:
This isn’t being abandoned. I just have so many obligations right now in my personal life that finding time to sit down and iron the rest of it out has been difficult. 2 14 month old boys, work, and other normal life obligations keep me pretty busy.
The page you linked is obviously just the boiler plate. When i get some time, I’ll update the main page and create some high level topics that, broadly speaking, cover most aspects of theory.
If you like, When i get some time to actually sit down and do this again, I’ll work on this section first if there are things you would like to add to it. I may be able to squeeze in some time today to get a bit more work done on this section of the forum. Let me know if this actually interests you, and I’ll prioritize that section.
Regarding contributing material to the forum:
I would say that if you have content you want to add, go ahead and start a new thread in The Studio for now, and add whatever content you would like. It can always be moved later on. There is nothing preventing you from contributing this sort of information now in the forum.
This goes for everyone else as well, for any sort of topic. If you make something you want added to the knowledge base in the future, tag me in a reply to said post or send me a dm and let me know which content you want to add. I’ll keep a list and get that added when it’s time.
Sorry for the delay in the Knowledge base section. It wasn’t supposed to take this long originally, but as my boys get older, then need more and more interaction and attention, so I’ve just been super crunched for time.
For what its worth, I care about theory, and feel like I still have so much to learn, so it is a topic I myself am very interested in. Can’t speak for the rest of the world though.
Let me know if you have any follow up questions or comments.
Thanks for the detailed reply @Guy_Wachtel you and @manton and @White_Noise and others have been doing an amazing job of keeping this forum alive, vibrant and relevant. Thank you!
The Theory category was always a little sleepy but I liked going there now and then to see what kinds of things people would post. In the IDMf before the big (no… it didn’t happen!) crash in 2018 there was a post about an on-line PDF of Music Theory that I thought was pretty straightforward and handy, I reposted that after it was lost from the older Forum. I’ve lost track of it and thought I go back to the forum to find it… but alas… not to be found. Who knows? I might stumble across it in my old notes and files.
No worries! Take your time, focus on those boys and keep up the good work! 
Don’t know if many of you here are on Threads, (I know a few are) but there is a rash of posts declaring Music Theory as either useless or actually harmful to the creative process. A further manifestation of the disdain for “experts” or “elites.”
I thought it was time to check out what sort of posts on the subject might be here on IDMf.
Obviously rebuilding this site has been a huge task. Kudos to those doing the heavy lifting and many thanks for their hard work and perserverance. 
Cool! Good to know it hasn’t been forgotten!
This what you’re looking for?
Maybe I misread you due to sleepy eyes, We’re not deleting any posts or sections. So you’re post it not lost!
Regarding Threads. I have lost interest in that platform as I find there is way too much noise on there. I might make the switch to what ever that “blue” one is called at some point, but alas not had the time to focus on the main stuff let alone that. Family focus is the priority right now.
Regarding theory, I would pay no attention to the kids on Threads. The importance of theory in anything still and will always remain.
If anyone wants to contribute to the Knowledge Base, forum or the label then i’m all for it. Just hit us up!
It takes a community to raise a….forum.
Amazing! Thank you @Manton YES this is the post I was looking for.
Is the link (or was it a file?) still available?
And regarding Threads. I’ve found some good people and some interesting discussions, but yes, there is some “noise” as well.
Family first, and when you get time, keep up the the good hard work you and others do to keep IDMf alive and well!
I’ve heard that little nugget of wisdom espoused off and on for decades, I suppose now amplified by the wonder of social media. At least in my experience, the people shouting about the creative shackles of theory rarely put out art that’s nearly as interesting and creative as they’d like to believe, and it seems to mostly be cover for being too lazy or intimidated to spend time learning. Or they’re too young to know better, but kids say dumb things - one of the perks of being young.
I guess that is to say I’m not surprised (though a little sad); you can find a dumb viral conspiracy on every corner of the internet, no reason music shouldn’t have a couple as well. When they change the musical landscape with their theory-less bangers, they’ll show us all.. 
Sadly I think it really is a case of the blind leading the blind. Someone has a splash of perceived success and decides there’s no merit in learning more, even on a personal-development level.
Or it’s the bot overlords trying to keep us all from striving for more. There’s my batshit conspiracy theory of the day 
Yes the link still works and I went there and downloaded the PDF and reuploaded it here in case the link breaks one day.
Oh yeah. I’m on threads as a lurker mostly, I’ve seen you there a handful of times.
First off… threads itself… wow, what a place…
I’ve not been active on any social media besides IG (and threads by extension), discord, and this forum (if you can call this place SM), for a long time, so maybe I’m just out of the loop on what the landscape looks like these days, but wow. Threads is a complete dumpster fire of specifically rage bait and just general bad takes 95% of the time. Its a little wild to me.
As far as the opposition to music theory goes, without having see specifically what people are saying, I get it partially. How can I present my thoughts in a concise way…
Firstly, to play devil’s advocate, i can see how theory could be “harmful” in certain situations:
Now I’m sure these scenarios happens to people in real life, sure, but like… I’m sure it’s a pretty damn small percentage. People who want to do music typically… you know… like music, so they’re going to pursue it regardless. So i think for most people these things probably are not a huge deal.
Now… the OPPOSITION to theory, to me, just doesn’t make any sense at all, especially as start to get into things like composing, or the fine motor skills used to play instruments. In fact, I’m willing to be that the people who talk shit about theory use theory literally ALL THE FUCKING TIME, whether they know it or not. Learning about the theory behind what you do is sort of like the next step in leveling up your game.
When you do learn theory (or even just start the journey of learning) you start building your ability to:
Idk, its just another tool to use, and in my opinion, one of the things that helps set you apart. And for those that have just natural really skill, It makes them EVEN better than they already were. I’m willing to bet that the greats who just had that raw latent skill, if they were serious about their music, would augment that skill with at least some theory studies.
TLDR: The arguments against it just don’t really hold water, and only idiots think its a detriment. There is a reason it has been around and continually developed for a long time, and still taught to serious musicians.
For a more short winded response to those “Threads ideas”, our peers have it nailed down more concisely
Thanks for the discussion. It’s a good one. 
Glad to see people here still care about musical theory and skill, even though most of us are just “non-expert” knob twiddlers.
As an aside… when I was a young lad in my adolescence / early teens, I have this memory of my dad telling me in regards to electronic style music “it doesn’t take skill! all you have to do is push buttons!”. He doesn’t listen to my music, and I don’t know if he still feels that way, but man, he was wrong, and I’m glad I didn’t take that “insight” to heart.
This is true. I’ve thought i never consciously use the theory that i learned and just relied on my ear to get by. But as @1roomstudio pointed out to me on threads, having learned it and been around it for 14 years, it would be naturally internalised.
I’ll go out on a limb and say knowing something is always better than not knowing it. Whether it affects a persons ability to use and manage that thing is on them. If knowing theory somehow holds you back from being creative (which I’d guess is the crux of their argument against it), that’s a personal problem, not a problem with the information.
Like you say, it’s a tool. Sometimes that tool is critical (you want to write Baroque-style concertos), sometimes not so much (musique concrete, noise, non-Western music which Western music theory rarely touches on, etc). Theory may not be directly pertinent to what you’re making, but it’s a hard sell to say it’s bad or useless - you can choose to ignore things you know, the opposite doesn’t really work in anyone’s favor.
On balance, I won’t discount the importance of artistic intuition and actually having something to say with your art - lots of amazing records have been made by ‘feel’ over theory, and I think intuition and voice probably have more to do with making a lasting piece of art than anything else. That said, theory never hurt no one.
Thank you! I managed to remember the name of it after your last post. Good to know where I can find it and I think it’s a solid resource for the Theory Buffs at IDMf.
I just now downloaded it and took a peek. I’d forgotten the Cheeky nature of it but I do remember that it was written for people who may not know music notation. So it is very beginner friendly but also comprehensive without being incomprehensible.
Wow! You nailed it! and stapled, glued, bundled, boxed, wrapped, banded and tied it up in a nice neat bow!
Impressive! but then… yours are also my thoughts exactly.
A good friend of mine who was a scientist (may he rest in peace!) and knew nothing about music once responded to my showing him how I compose IDM with “Interesting, but that’s not really music.” He wasn’t intending to insult (nor did I take it that way) he simply had a narrow understanding of what the definition of “music” is. He was a Kenny G fan. 
I’ve had people say things like that as well.
I think for some, anything non-traditional (or that can’t technically be played at a campfire) simply doesnt register as music at all. I genuinely don’t know if some people can even tell that basic theory principles govern all of it, all the way down to the most abstract IDM on the planet. I understand if people say harsh noise or wall noise isn’t music (I still beg to differ there, even though it’s a hard sell), but I definitely don’t want to live with those narrow definitions, either.
Well said.
And you reminded me that my scientist friend had a bit of an obsession with the definition of the word “art” he would carefully collect and compare different definitions from different dictionaries and especially older dictionaries. He was a fascinating guy to have a discussion with on any subject and often in the heat of a debate he would say “that depends on the definition of the word (insert “word” here)”
I miss you Joe! 