How were you taught US history?

Just a random thought I had, and since I know we have many people here that are outside of the US i wanted to get a brief query from folks interested in responding.

For those who live and were educated outside of the US, how were you taught about US history, or what did you learn in school about the United States?

Similarly, for those who grew up in the US, how do you feel about the education you received regarding the country and it’s history? Do you feel like what you were taught is consistent with the reality of the country?

I feel like we’re kind of getting close to political shit with this, so lets just make sure we keep it civil. Feel free to brain-dump whatever you’ve got.

1 Like

I don’t remember being taught anything about US history. Australia is already very Americanised through pop culture, so we got enough outside of school.

The only US history we may have been taught (briefly) were old battles, of which I can’t remember the names of, and perhaps the declaration of independance. But I may be mixing my memories of things I’ve learnt from movies (i.e. pop culture) haha.

2 Likes

Makes sense. I know i phrased it kind of presumptuously, but I figured that many outside of the US would not have specifically been taught US history.

1 Like

I was taught to do my own research.

From my own research.

Murica was discovered by the native americans during the ice ages…

It was rediscovered multiple times.

Then in the middle ages the europeans discovered america and started to make expeditions.

In summary the europeans conquered the americas through various means.

Then the british colonies happened. Then the revolution no taxation without representation. America became an independent nation.

Fast forward…the civil war occurred because some americans had a conscious and fought over what america is gonna be…

A secular free society for all. Or something else.

The free society side won the civil war.

Then ww1 and then ww2…and afterwards the cold war.

And now…blah blah blah.

2 Likes

Also can we have a rule…if a person claims that their source is tiktok or any other social media…

They have to wash benwaas minge.

1 Like

Honestly, it all went in one ear and out the other.

Might’ve had something to do with my inability to work out what other people are feeling, their intentions and motivations (something I still grapple with, and end up extremely confused about), but any time I was taught history I just had so many questions that I would’ve driven any teacher insane, so I didn’t say much. Probably a smart move, admittedly, even though I didn’t know what I was actually doing at the time.

When people outside the US know a decent amount of US history, I’m pretty much dumbfounded due to knowing absolutely nothing about their country. I mean, I can’t even keep up with mine… they must have serious superpowers :smiley:

2 Likes

I’ve never learnt it properly, had to teach myself on the parts I wanted to know. (I’m Australian, so you can kinda figure…)
As for Australian history, I learnt most of that stuff in primary school, actually. When I got to high school they just stopped teaching AUSTRALIAN history and taught us about things like the Aztecs and Indigenous Australian history.
I s’pose, not the place to really say anything about THAT though, huh?
:neutral_face::expressionless::neutral_face:

2 Likes

I could write a very long post about my understanding of US history. I was one class short of an econ minor in business school, and Econ actually lives with history and philosophy over in the Humanities branch of education (it just gets lumped with business because that’s where most of the practical applications lie, but the first economists were philosophers and historians). Anyways, I have probably a better understanding than the average bear about US history, it’s just 11 o clock and I was supposed to be asleep an hour ago, so I will come back during the week and drop that on you. Seriously though, I got college level US history and government during highschool and again in college, so I got the broad strokes twice from two different sources on other ends of the political spectrum. I’m fortunate that I remember enough that I can compare and contrast the two viewpoints and arrive at something resembling the truth in between.

2 Likes

orem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.

3 Likes

I never learned of certain things…and found out about certain events on my own.

Like the history of social issues were glossed over…and certain things were omitted.

But the recent trend of faux political historical mythology generated by idiots is unethical imo…

Because the facists in post ww1 germany also believed in a faux political historical mythology.

I.e.

Iven seen people spew crap like how… america was discovered by the ancient cross cultural sumerian god xenochtitltazxochulatan…that was actually an ancient alien from the space colony of atlantis that destroyed itself when the aliens started fornicating with the original human race of neandrathals creating super half breeds called the nephilim of which all of modern man is descendants of. But the aliens over the course of history inflitrated humanity by covertly ascending to power to various leadership roles to control and purge all evidence of this…so that us the descended nephilim would be subjugated and oppressed when the aliens reinvaded to completely conquer the earth…and it all starts with voting for [pick any politician]…to decide the fate of humanity…

The source…tiktok asspull…

^the worst thing is that fools believe in that sort of stuff to justify their own political extremism…

So yeah…

When shit like that is assumed to be history…im just like thats a whole lotta nope.

In short, very poorly. Every single year we went over a version of Plymouth Rock - Reconstruction (Civil War) and that’s it. Nothing else ever in K-12. So, basically the quasi-myth of how the US was created.

2 Likes

So when I was taught US history, I spent about a quarter of the time focusing on pre-independent America. Who came here and why, and relations with the natives. The short version is you had religious extremists who weren’t welcome in europe move in up north (that’s your Plymouth Rock people). Early on, America’s relationship with the natives was pretty much non-existent. That is to say, the natives knew the settlers were there, but they were content to leave them alone because most of the coastal lands were useless to them (no good for crops, which was a problem for those early northeast settlements, more than one starved and failed). And the settlers knew the natives where there, but they had witches to hang and children to starve so they didn’t really interact with them. This would be basically true until about 1600, give or take.

Further south, charters were granted for colonies by England with the idea that they could go over there and farm stuff. It turned out a few things grew really well in the southern colonies - tobacco, cotton, and indigo, the cash crops of the south from it’s inception all the way through the civil war. Only problem was that these are labor intensive crops to grow (back then the cotton had to be cleaned by hand, for example) and there were like 5 wealthy land owners in the south. So where do you get workers? You’re all thinking slaves right? WRONG. First source of labor was indentured servants. Basically, you take the poors from England, the second sons who are never going to get an inheritance, etc. And you tell them they can make a fresh start in the colonies. They get a free boat ride over, then it’s 7 years of hard labor (which they will probably survive), then they get a little plot of land for themselves. Not enough for their own plantation or anything, but enough for them to be a landowner and subsist for themselves - which is more than these people were ever going to have in England.

That worked for about 20 years and then England was more or less out of people that desperate, which is when the slave trade kicked into gear. I sit here and make this distinction because it’s important to emphasize that slavery in America started as a solution to an economic/labor problem, and would later morph into the race issue we know it as today. What was done to those people is terrible either way, and there were absolutely terrible people who mistreated slaves and so on. However, at this time the majority of owners were businessmen who had a problem to solve and were looking for the most effective solution. It’s cold and heartless to put it that way, but it is a key point to understand that slavery would later lead to racism, and not the other way around. We will come back to that idea in about another hundred years, for now it’s time to check in on the north.

It’s been a while and we haven’t really checked in on the natives, how are they doing? Turns out they’re dying in droves. Fun fact, smallpox decimated 90% of the native populations in both north and south america, without the colonists having to lift a finger. It turns out the natives had never cultivated livestock in the americas, while this had been done since the days of Egypt/Mesopatamia in the old world. This is important to highlight because being that close to livestock for long is going to expose you to weird new germs. Now, if you have a population that has done this for a few thousand years they will have built up a resistance to those germs. The native americans? Not so much. This wasn’t even a “blankets laced with smallpox” thing (though to be sure that was used as a weapon of war too) so much as it was a lack of awareness of the germs on both sides. The natives come into town, trade with the Europeans, catch smallpox, bring it back to their village, whole village dies except one person who doesn’t realize he already has it and is contagious, so he rides to the next village to warn everyone, thus spreading the disease to the next village. Rinse and repeat until a few hundred million are dead. Still not a whole lot of interaction between natives and colonists at this point, on account of the whole “we all die every time we talk to them” thing.

The north is becoming a bit of a trade hub in the 1600s. Triangular trade is in full swing, where slaves come in to the south, the south sends crops up north, the north processes the crops (since they can’t grow shit) and sends the processed goods east in exchange for more slaves, which come back in to the south. It seems like the country is growing and the sky’s the limit, but in the mid 1600s this will start to change. I’ll tell you more about that later.

2 Likes

A short-ish answer:

Up until college, there was no “learning US history” per se. By that I mean: we learned through the various grades the history of the planet, literally from Prehistory to the modern day, in chronological order, so obviously it did include the discovery of the American continent and what became of it afterwards at some point.

Considering it was just high school, I’m pretty sure it was already much more evolved than what US students learn in their high schools about their own country. My American wife, who is far from stupid (some of you already know she has a Master’s Degree in Jungian studies), confirmed many times that I knew way more about the US history than she ever did and she’s certainly embarrassed although it’s not her fault…

After high school, I got an English language related BA equivalent, and I learned a lot more specifics about the country, including the political system, how the country developed (in-depth), etc. etc.

I remember going through the 100 potential questions for the US citizenship exam some 5-6 years ago and I could still answer correctly 90% of them, 20+ years after graduating.

So all in all, I think that, even in the 80’s-90’s, Europeans knew way more about US history than US kids did…

One thing that slayed me was hearing about “Black History month” the first time around. I asked my wife what that was and couldn’t stop laughing about the stupidity of the concept of separating “Black” history from the creation of the US, and then “learning” it for a month. Good old American hypocrisy and rewriting of history, I suppose. Surprised there’s never been “Native American Week” or something as well :grin:

3 Likes
2 Likes

IDK about the rest of the country, but in california they changed Columbus Day to Indigenous People’s Day.

2 Likes

So I’m like super busy, but I have a minor correction to make on my previous long post, things did not change until the mid 1700s, not the mid 1600s. Short version is England lost some wars and needed money, and taxing citizens on the island was unpopular, but taxing colonists an ocean away that didn’t have any representation in the government? Easy peasy. So they started taxing America’s exports going to England. And since America was a british colony, they weren’t allowed to trade with anyone else unless England said so. This pissed a lot of people off, but they bore it. Then England added more taxes until it got to the point in 1763 that you had a pay a tax for the stamp that went onto your tax documents (the Stamp Tax). That was it. That was the breaking point where you got stuff like the Boston Tea Party.

In fact, when the Continental Congress got together to talk about the english problem, they were not talking about independence at first, they wanted “pre-1763 conditions”. It would be a few more years until writers like Thomas Paine and Benjamin Franklin would point out that America by itself had more people than Britain and a larger potential economy, but we would never be more than farmland for the brits if we didn’t break away. So when it became clear that negotiating for lower taxes wasn’t going over well, and that even if America was granted representation in parliament it would be one or two seats that couldn’t really control anything, that was when independence started to look like the better option.

The revolutionary war was a thing. Wasn’t taught that much about it, has more to do with military history than overall history. What you need to know is England could have won that war, but they couldn’t really afford to win the war - remember money problems are what landed them in this situation in the first place. France helped us, becoming our first ally. Not really that important, but you can drop that shit at trivia night.

After America gained independence, it will be important to look at how the constitution gets ratified, because that sets up 80 years of conflict that will lead to the Civil War.

The short short version is that by this point the North has industrialized and they don’t need slaves to be economically competitive anymore. Take the economic need away and slavery just starts to look like a shitty thing. The South, however, is still farming for the most part, and they need slaves to make their cash crops happen. The North doesn’t want slaves, the South feels they need slaves. So, like any two sides in politics, they compromise. There will be no slavery in the North, and South can have slaves. However, there will be no slave trade in Washington DC (even though it’s technically in the South) and after 1820, the South cannot import any new slaves, only use existing ones. You can tell by the way this is written that it was a compromise to get the South on board, that the North knew this was wrong, and they were trying to keep it out of sight of any visiting foreign politicians by keeping it out of the capital and trying to write in an expiration date to give the South some time to get its shit together and “grow up”. However, it would turn out that the next 80 years would continue to try to kick the can down the road and not tell the South “no”. Without a doubt, this is the original sin of the country, the one mistake in our founding. We should have stopped it then and there at whatever cost, because things would only get worse from here.

I mentioned earlier that racism would come from slavery. It would start to become an argument in the early 1800s for why slaves couldn’t be freed. When people from the North would ask the South why they even needed slaves, when we were all industrializing and machines were clearly going to be able to do the job soon enough, the South would respond that it was their moral imperative to take in these savages and teach them the righteous ways of the white man, as much as they could. It started to be said that the blacks were naturally lazier and dumber than the whites, hence their need to be enslaved so they could make something of themselves. Who could argue with a law of nature like that? It would be insane to let all those people loose at once with nothing to do.

I’m serious, if you go and research this, before american independence slavery is just an economic convenience, it doesn’t morph into a racist thing until after independence when slavery is under threat of being made illegal that the south weaves it into their culture and makes it a moral/religious/ethnic thing, specifically to make it harder to get rid of.

That’s one of the key takeaways to american history for me, that in trying to compromise on slavery at our founding, I think we made things worse in the long run. About the first 3rd of our history as a nation is dominated by keeping the number of slave states equal to free states to maintain political balance as we expand west. All becuase of a few lines in the Constitution.

2 Likes

Italians also used to be victims of lynch mobs in america…because of the anti immigrant thing…

Columbus day was created as a holiday…as a symbolic gesture of some sorts.

How columbus day became symbolic of something else…is really beyond me…

I guess as time passes the meaning of things change as do the circumstances…

Blah blah blah nvm tangential stuff…

A cursory google search seems to suggest that the first Colombus day was sort of a one time deal in an attempt to try and smooth things over with Italian-Americans as well as Italy after the mob lynchings. Kinda weird to me off the bat, as it seems like the only thing these events have in common was that it is believed that CC was Italian.

It would seem that years after the first Colombus day, a Catholic organization (The Knights of Columbus) requested that it become a yearly celebration. This time however, it would be a day to commemorate the discovery of the new world (according to one source, I have not looked at others so this may be incorrect). I’m assuming that Italian Immigrants we’re likely Catholic? I don’t know much about this stuff… but that seems to track in my head.

Regardless, it seems like the divergence between the original one time appeared once it became a yearly holiday, since it seems like thats when, at the request of The Knights of Columbus, the wording and meaning of the day was altered slightly. I would Imagine that Italian Immigrants have frequently over the years celebrated the day as a remembrance of the mob killings.

I did not know any of this about the lynching of Italian Americans or the original reason for the holiday, I always knew it simply as a day of celebrating the discover of the americas by CC, so maybe history and the public education system didn’t get the message

I think this is probably just peoples realization that Colombus was a shitty, brutal person. As far as I know, even his contemporaries viewed him a such. I certainly don’t think he is a man worth celebrating based off of what I know of him. It would seem to me that we could have had a holiday to remember the victims without having to associate it with that dude. That’s my guess at how the symbolism changed (or at least how peoples views of CC as a symbol have changed).

Indigenous peoples day is to me a far better way to celebrate. Although, that being said, knowing what I now know, It seems we have lost a holiday in honor of the Italian immigrants who were lynched.

IDK, I’m way outside of my depth of knowledge on this stuff. Feel free to correct my mistakes.

Side note: @White_Noise I’m loving these knowledge bombs you’re sending our way. I’m going to try and find ways to keep you talking. haha. Really interesting stuff. It makes me want to take a class or something.

2 Likes

Id prefer a leonardo da vinci day…or at least a amerigo vespucci day

Before we continue down the timeline and look at westward expansion - which I admit I’m going to be weak on as there’s bunch of dates I don’t remember off the top of my head and I don’t really have a great explanation beyond a brief summary of america’s interactions with the natives at this point - it would be worthwhile to look at some early presidents and the political precedents (and warnings) they set.

George Washington was elected pretty much unopposed and unanimously for two terms in 1796 and 1800. Elections back then would look pretty alien to what you’d see as election coverage today. Important to note is that early on, you didn’t vote for a president/vice president pair (that would be a later amendment to the constitution), instead the person with a majority of votes was president and the second most votes was vice president -often a member of the opposing party (and president of the senate, which the vice president still is today - they get called in for tiebreaker votes and such).

GW didn’t have a party, because political parties didn’t exist yet. When the constitution was written, the idea was that representatives and senators would be elected for their stances on various issues (and I guess based on their reputation/character). They would then get to congress, which would need to address a particular issue for the country (let’s say some sort of nationwide noise ordinance). The senators/reps would break off into various camps on that issue, maybe some support no regulation, some support a noise limit to what is phsyically harmful, and some support a noise limit that is limited to what is annoying to the average person. Those “parties” would hash out a law, send it to the president, and then move on to the next issue, maybe something like a national speed limit. They would then break into new groups based on what they thought the best law would be in this regard. And so on and so forth. The idea was never for there to be permanent political parties that had pre-defined stances on most issues.

It was clear that idea wasn’t panning out within 8 years, because congress was growing divided and about the only thing they had universal agreement on was that GW was pretty tight. Then GW famously refused to run for a 3rd term of president and suddenly the two sides of congress both felt the need to get “their guy” in the president’s office. It was the first proto-election as you’d recognize it today, with two large factions throwing their weight behind someone to advance the faction’s agenda, rather than basing the elections purely on the merit of the candidates. To a greater or lesser extent, this has been true ever since.

In his farewell speech, GW warned the nation of what he had seen in electing his successor. He warned that this was not the system the founders had set out to create, that it was not meant to function this way, and that the country would suffer for it at some point. But, he was done. Good timing on his part because he died two years later, wouldn’t have finished the term.

GW gets flak these days for being a slave owner, or excluding women or people of color from the early government of the US. However, I still think he deserves a lot of cred for laying the foundations of the first modern democracy. He tried as hard as he could to unify the government that was splitting itself into pieces underneath him (which is a lesson I wish ANY presidential candidate today could learn). He set the precedent that no one person should lead this country more than 8 years (which was violated one time by FDR before being ammended into the constitution). He set the precedent of being called Mr. President rather than his Highness (which is what people wanted to call him at first). He did a lot of important little things to humanize the office of president and bring it closer to the people.

Other early presidents would set the standard for political parties going forward. Thomas Jefferson would found the Democratic Republican party and get elected. That party still exists today as the Democrats.

Things would get figured out by these presidents, such as who buys land, and how? That’s not in the constitution (and is going to be kind of a big deal for the next 50 years), but the president does have power to make treaties, and so all US land deals are treaties of one sort or another, for example.

The Supreme Court would hear landmark cases that set precedents we all take for granted today. For instance, a state law can’t supersede federal law - ask any legal pot shop owner how fun this makes banking for them, because their product is federally illegal - which means they cannot put their money into most banks because the funds would be siezed under federal law. The supremacy of federal law wasn’t a given early on, and that wasn’t decided until 1824.

I’m not writing a textbook here, so we’re going to start glossing over more stuff as we move along, but these are some things I thought were worth calling out.

3 Likes