Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced
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Old 03-09-2014, 01:25 AM   #1
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Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

So today Ni announced a new Komplete and they also announced a new complete controller, and they have 3 brand new synths.


One of these synths is called Rounds which is supposed to be like digital + analog combined, and they have also introduced another drum sampler called polyplex. This is the latest of drum samplers in line with battery and maschine.

I am excited to see what these can do even though I have been getting into analog a lot more then digital lately. I am looking forward to it, and I myself my be purchasing komplete 10 ultimate and upgrading from regular komplete 9 as well as trying out this new keyboard.

For me personally this will probably be the end all be all digital until I transcend into only Ni, Omnispehre and analog. I am deffinatly looking forward to witnissing the power of Rounds and possibly this midi controller more than anyhting. This is supposed to be able to load up and automap to any ni instrument in a daw or in maschine, and comes in 25 keys, 49, and 61 keys. I'd like to know your thoughts on this?

Is it just another digital product for you, or does it tickle your fancy? I am excited to test the power, and might be making this purchase if I can get deals and see this midi controller in action.

Official release for both are October 1st.

I will say I don't like the fact that it's priced like an actual synth and its just a midi controller, and that is probably the biggest thing that will hold me back or could when considering the controller itself.

Last edited by NewWorldOrder; 03-09-2014 at 01:31 AM..

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Old 03-09-2014, 05:48 AM   #2
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I actually think the S-Series is great. It kind of picks up where Kore left off when their team was absorbed into the Maschine team. Kore was a really great controller and this is essentially the Kore controller wrapped up in a keyboard. It has some great MIDI features like scaling and chords that I've found are generally lacking, even on modern keyboard controllers. The demo of those features looked pretty impressive. The LEDs (aka " Light Guide™") are great. Being able to see the Kontakt bank layout on the keyboard is really useful, particularly for live performance. And the direct visual feedback for scales and chords will be useful for less accomplished musicians.

As I understand it, the interface will function similarly to Kore, with a software plugin that wraps Komplete instruments. I assume controller input would make use of NI's HID format which is much higher resolution than MIDI (by a factor of 100 or 1,000 from memory). This could be a potential drawback though. It means that, like Maschine, controller automation is restricted to the plugin only.

This brings up another issue which is; how will it function with third party plugins and DAWs? Will you be able to map out third party plugins within the NI S-Series plugin, like you can Maschine? How will it handle general MIDI data? While they respond brilliantly in native HID mode, NI's controllers are consistently dysfunctional when it comes to MIDI data. I sould say though, that I have not had my hands on the more recent Maschine Studio or latest generation Traktor Kontrol series so I can't comment on whether MIDI response has been improved over the past year. I'm just making assumptions.

As for the price tag, I don't think it's that unreasonable when you factor in the discounts they are offering on Komplete 10 packages. I would assume the build quality will be good. I've had S1s and Maschines being constantly used on stage and in the studio without any problems with the hardware. And if the MIDI functions (scale, chords etc) are native to the controller and not the plugin and the plugin/keyboard works well with third parties, then I reckon it's a good deal. But unless you are going to upgrade to Komplete 10 you wouldn't buy this keyboard. Clearly none of the Komplete functionality will work with previous versions (like Maschine integration only worked for K8 [or K9?] users) so existing Komplete users have nothing to gain without the update.

I will say though, Native Instruments seem to be on top of their game with Komplete now. They are continuously rolling out great software products and their approach to design is so well geared towards performance. I remember when I first got my hands on a Kore controller it was the closest any interface at the time came to replicating the feel of hardware patching with software. And the combination of Maschine, Komplete and a keyboard is brilliant for live performance. I would imagine that if I was playing a set on keys I would prefer playing on an S-Series and leaving Maschine at home.
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Old 03-09-2014, 06:14 AM   #3
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

As for the price tag on the "Kontroller" it's competitive with Push and seems to be the going rate for products of this nature these days. I mean it's probably basically the same thing, only with keys not pads and, obviously, NI specific (probably / maybe). I'd say if komplete is heavily integrated into your setup the price is fair based upon going market rates for products in a similar category.

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Old 03-09-2014, 07:20 AM   #4
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I have no need for the keyboard but the K10 update will purchased. Quite fancy some of the new stuff since K9. The upgrade cost for Ultimate is quite hefty though.

As soon as I saw the lights on the keyboard I knew they'd be mapping the keyboard zones within Kontakt to it. It looks rather like a children's toy though. It might be ace but it looks a bit crappy, at least in the pictures I've seen. However if its a handy aid to performance who cares what it looks like, I hope those that get it have a great time because I'm sure it will work well

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Old 03-09-2014, 11:49 PM   #5
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

Yeah the only vsts I really use come from Komplete 9 so yeah Komplete digitally is a big peace of my digital sound. It just cost the price as a synth and that on top of the price I will pay for an upgrade to komplete 10 ultimate is more than I will pay when I get another actual analog synth to my collection.

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Old 04-09-2014, 04:35 AM   #6
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

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Originally Posted by RFJ View Post
As for the price tag on the "Kontroller" it's competitive with Push and seems to be the going rate for products of this nature these days.
Yeah, I've seen heaps of people griping about the price. NI's Australian RRP ranges from $699.00 for the 25 key to $999 for the 66 key model. This is pretty high if it's just for a control surface. But, like Maschine, it's not just a controller. It's a hardware / software interface. It's worth remembering that NI's prices on initial manufacture are always quite higher. Maschine MkI was over a thousand dollars on launch. Six months later, it was $650. Once S-Series sales pick up, I suspect the prices will be dropped by at least 33%. And I really think a lot of people will be buying this. The Kore community was solid and they were pretty pissed when NI discontinued its development.

The other consideration on the pricing is the quality of the keybed. Apparently the keybed is really good. Not fully weighted, but still apparently heavier than most comparable semi-weighted keybeds. As a player, I can tell you that makes any keyboard well worth the while. At times, I've been willing to spend more than $300 extra for a MIDI controller with less features but better keys. I'd imagine that good keys in conjunction with native HID input will make for a very responsive playing experience.

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I mean it's probably basically the same thing, only with keys not pads and, obviously, NI specific (probably / maybe). I'd say if komplete is heavily integrated into your setup the price is fair based upon going market rates for products in a similar category.
After a bit more research, I am fairly certain that the S-Series plugin bundle is going to be very similar in functionality to Kore. The one feature I really hope they have carried over from Kore is support for third party plugins. In Kore, you were able to load 3rd party VSTi and VST plugins and map them to the Kore controller.

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As soon as I saw the lights on the keyboard I knew they'd be mapping the keyboard zones within Kontakt to it. It looks rather like a children's toy though. It might be ace but it looks a bit crappy, at least in the pictures I've seen. However if its a handy aid to performance who cares what it looks like, I hope those that get it have a great time because I'm sure it will work well
I don't know. I've never bought gear for its looks. Function is more important. The only really obvious function of these lights are the performance and the Kontakt feedback. I use Kontakt and I can tell you, I've played plenty of gigs in dark clubs and these lights would have been really useful, along with LCD displays for each control on the surface. I hope that they find more functions for the lights. For example, some more clear octave feedback for performance, colour codes for plugins like the Finger etc.

To be honest, I am amazed there aren't more keyboard controllers with this kind of lighting available.
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Old 04-09-2014, 09:34 AM   #7
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

Also, I read somewhere that all of the MIDI scale and chord functions are native to the controller as well as performance feedback on the light guides. So you can use all of those features in DAW and other third party environments.
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Old 05-09-2014, 07:51 PM   #8
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I will probably get it because it wil make massive feel less like "Make skrillex bass frowl pt2" and more like we can finally have hands on with digital, and as a composer or a trained musician it makes my life a heck of a lot easier if the scales and chords are built in. It is pricey and I get a discount because I have komplete 9, but I mean altogether this price is basically the price of a decent analog synth.

It could be argued that komplete 10 + this controller is worth it because for this price yes you could get a decent analog synth, but this becomes like a digital synth and makes it more in the real world with virtual analog or analog, and gives a bit more human and creative side in the way of making it and exploring it so we can transcend , "how to get fat 808s in massive". I know that wont really go away and isn't bad, but I am just saying it will be less generic. I want a prophet 08 and I might have to pick both of these things up!

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Old 08-09-2014, 07:31 AM   #9
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I want you all to know I completely snapped back into my right mind when I realized I could get a mopo x4 for around the same price I could get the 61 key s-control + komplete 10 ultimate. This thing is way too over priced.

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Old 08-09-2014, 07:36 AM   #10
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

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I want you all to know I completely snapped back into my right mind when I realized I could get a mopo x4 for around the same price I could get the 61 key s-control + komplete 10 ultimate. This thing is way too over priced.
Are you going to get a Mopho X4?

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Old 08-09-2014, 08:34 AM   #11
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

What makes you think a mopho is worth more?
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Old 08-09-2014, 08:54 AM   #12
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I am not impressed by the new controllers. They are made for Komplete and that is ok but for users with alot of third party plugins will not have more functionality by using the NI`s. Also I think that only eight knobs is not that much, stepping through pages will be a must.
The keyboards dont do much more than a good Akai, Novation...
The screens only show parameter values, not really a step forward.
A bit more of Maschine Studio style would had been cool. I love my Studio as the screens show much of what is going on but these keyboards show just little information.

Almost forgot, the price for the controllers are way to high, it`s just Midi going on...

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Old 08-09-2014, 08:28 PM   #13
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

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What makes you think a mopho is worth more?
For the desired sounds I want I think analog beats digital. Also the mopho is more than just a midi controller. I do understand there are the scale thing, the chord thing, and many other features for midi, but I could do that anyway in any daw. I think over all actually the sound of mopho would be better than the sound of komplete 10 synths. Mopho also has a lot already built into it so as with all audio its less taxing on my pc, and many more features that are typical to analog synth.

I would mainly get the ni + komplete 10 ultimate for like ease of use and for more creative juice or innovation. However until I am not convinced at this point in my musical life digital is what I need. The biggest reason for me honestly is the 3 new synths I'd like to try those, and just to see if this would help my creative flow.

Also the keys looked very ehhh on that ni insturment. It seems like a glorified midi controller, and for my wallet its up against a synth I know I could get for under 1k. I could get ni for under 1k, but that would mean I'd have to go down from ultimate to regular komplete 10 and the whole purpose for me to get komplete 10 now is for cinematic effects, and in fact the only thing that makes komplete 10 regular any tempting for me at all is the 3 new synths.

I still think that an analog sound is more up my alley, but I understand that is preference.

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Are you going to get a Mopho X4?
yes.

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Old 06-10-2014, 08:22 PM   #14
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

Ok so Komplete 10 Ultimate arrived today and now installed.

Initial impressions...

...Utterly underwhelmed, and in a few cases actually pissed off.

Out of the box Molekular doesn't even work and eats CPU like crazy while making no noise whatsoever.

Rounds and Kontour don't even appear to be installed.

Lots of drum kits... in Kontakt. What? With so limited output routing control why bother putting drum kits into Kontakt instead of Battery. I could understand if they updated Kontakt so it had decent output routing but its the same crappy channel control it has always had.

Rather than designing actual new synths, they're just putting CPU guzzlers with flashy graphics into their other products.

Why does Polyplex even exist? Its a children's toy inferior to Battery in terms of programmability and it gives you a small amount of things to play with while eating your CPU like tapeworm-infested cops in a doughnut factory.

If you have Komplete 9, any flavour, I don't think its worth upgrading to K10. I've not checked out the new FX yet but of the instruments my initial impression is that there is nothing worth spending all that money on.

Komplete 10 Is the Windows Vista of Native Instruments.

If you have K9, avoid. If you don't have K8 or 9, its possibly worth the upgrade.

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Old 07-10-2014, 02:28 AM   #15
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

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Originally Posted by Stercogburn View Post
Ok so Komplete 10 Ultimate arrived today and now installed.

Initial impressions...

...Utterly underwhelmed, and in a few cases actually pissed off.

Out of the box Molekular doesn't even work and eats CPU like crazy while making no noise whatsoever.

Rounds and Kontour don't even appear to be installed.

Lots of drum kits... in Kontakt. What? With so limited output routing control why bother putting drum kits into Kontakt instead of Battery. I could understand if they updated Kontakt so it had decent output routing but its the same crappy channel control it has always had.

Rather than designing actual new synths, they're just putting CPU guzzlers with flashy graphics into their other products.

Why does Polyplex even exist? Its a children's toy inferior to Battery in terms of programmability and it gives you a small amount of things to play with while eating your CPU like tapeworm-infested cops in a doughnut factory.

If you have Komplete 9, any flavour, I don't think its worth upgrading to K10. I've not checked out the new FX yet but of the instruments my initial impression is that there is nothing worth spending all that money on.

Komplete 10 Is the Windows Vista of Native Instruments.

If you have K9, avoid. If you don't have K8 or 9, its possibly worth the upgrade.
I have komplete 9, and I actually decided to get moog sub 37 instead of the remote+ komplete 10.

I am also underwhelmed. I have Maschine 2.0, so like polyplex seems kompletly worthless. I really am interested in seeing the power of rounds and kontour, but I have only seen one or two videos. I do want to hear what they sound like, but after Monark I cant say I actually look forward to more vst "analog". Kontour kind of reminds me of something between a reaktor plugin already created and like fm8.

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Old 11-10-2014, 09:12 AM   #16
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

What pisses me off is that NI made changes to K10 and brings the new controllers to market that togehter will take your Maschine to a new level. Really stupid shit going on. They force you to buy other NI products so that an other product gets new features. This is for sure the wrong way!

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Old 11-10-2014, 10:51 AM   #17
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I complained to NI, and got a download link for Rounds and Kontour. Other people had reported the issue that these products weren't included in the package.

Rounds is good fun and may have saved K10 from being a washout all by itself. Is good for creating sounds that have a lot of movement in them, or sequences. Kontour has terrible presets and my first impression was not good. However, it only took a little bit of tweaking to start producing some decent sounds from Kontour.

The new pianos are good but if you have Alicia's Key's, not sure on their own they make K10 worth getting.

Still not played with the new FX yet as, with the exception of Guitar Rig, I do most of my EQ and FX with non-NI stuff.

Rounds and Kontour cost £89 each. Is arguable that if you have K9U, you're better off just buying these and upgrading when K11u comes along. Its a marginal call.

On hindsight I think part of the reason I was so pissed off because the 2 main things I'd been looking forward to, and paid a premium price for, weren't included in the external HDD NI sent out. I feel mildly better towards NI now. Mildly.

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Old 13-10-2014, 07:47 AM   #18
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

Quote:
I complained to NI, and got a download link for Rounds and Kontour. Other people had reported the issue that these products weren't included in the package.

Rounds is good fun and may have saved K10 from being a washout all by itself. Is good for creating sounds that have a lot of movement in them, or sequences. Kontour has terrible presets and my first impression was not good. However, it only took a little bit of tweaking to start producing some decent sounds from Kontour.

The new pianos are good but if you have Alicia's Key's, not sure on their own they make K10 worth getting.

Still not played with the new FX yet as, with the exception of Guitar Rig, I do most of my EQ and FX with non-NI stuff.

Rounds and Kontour cost £89 each. Is arguable that if you have K9U, you're better off just buying these and upgrading when K11u comes along. Its a marginal call.

On hindsight I think part of the reason I was so pissed off because the 2 main things I'd been looking forward to, and paid a premium price for, weren't included in the external HDD NI sent out. I feel mildly better towards NI now. Mildly.
I have the regular complete 9, and I decided to get Omnisphere instead of komplete 10, and I gotta say I am seriously regretting not getting komplete 10 ultimate instead. I love ambiance and trip hop and all of that, but I don't want something that feels so linear. If I want complexity I'd have just gotten another hardware synth, but thats a rant for another day. That seems like a slip for them to not include the main products in the package. I have been looking at youtube videos and Rounds looks pretty cool. Kontour reminds me of something edmish for some reason.

Quote:
What pisses me off is that NI made changes to K10 and brings the new controllers to market that togehter will take your Maschine to a new level. Really stupid shit going on. They force you to buy other NI products so that an other product gets new features. This is for sure the wrong way!
what does komplete 10 do for the maschine controller?

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Old 13-10-2014, 03:59 PM   #19
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

Watch the video about the coming update of Machine 2.2 and you will see what I mean. Some Maschine 2.2 features will be only available with the new controllers and work only in K10.

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Old 21-10-2014, 09:01 AM   #20
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Re: Komplete 10 + New Komplete Controller announced

I went along to an in-shop demo run by NI of Komplete 10 and the S-Series keyboards, really impressed. I was keen to get Komplete anyway but the integration with the keyboards looks amazing. Highlights of the dem for me:
  • Keyboard integration with dials mapped to most commonly used functions of the plugin in question. This looks really good for tweaking sounds in an intuitive way without having to touch the mouse
  • Chords and scales built in with key highlighting and "easy" type modes which will correct plays within a scale or automatically play chords for you - great for learning musical theory if (like me) your theory is still pretty basic.
  • Tagging and searching allows you to switch between presets across the whole of Komplete rather than just one instrument, so if you're looking for bass noises just ask it for everything tagged bass and then scroll through, it'll load the instruments as it needs to.
  • Rounds looks like a fantastic new synth - it combines a step sequence with 8 analogue and 8 digital synth voices, up to 4 of which can be played simultaneously on any step. You can get some really cool sounds out of it.

I think if you use Komplete a lot the keyboard will actually improve your workflow pretty drastically. Definitely go and give it a hands-on in a store if you get the chance.

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