[Oatbag]

Fentanyl - what the fuck? Is it actually being mixed into everything? Media hyping up shit? Drug dealers gone full asshole? Government conspiracies?

I know locally this seems to have become a real issue. People are legit dying in a way that never happened here during the big non event crystal meth scare of 10 years ago.

[oDDgOD]

Its been a growing issue in the US. Every time you turn on the news now there's a story about mass overdoses of fentanyl,oxy,etc...in towns all across the country. Either from people using it directly, or it being a cutting agent in other drugs.

Fentanyl is nothing to play with. Its what they use to put people in drug induced comas for medical reasons. My son had to have it at birth because he required a series of heart procedures too intense for him to handle so they knocked him out with fentanyl for 3 weeks. Scared the shit out of me.

[relic]

I know that some people addicted to opiates prefer fentanyl, but its harder to come by than pain pills. Those patches are only for people with serious chronic pain. I did hear in the local news supposedly heroin dealers are "cutting" their product with fentanyl , but again...it honestly doesn't make sense from what I know about rarity/cost.

I even recently read something about fake xanax bars being made with fentanyl, which, again makes no economic sense to me.

[Artificer]

The current issue apparently stems from the fact that dealers can get fentanyl/analog dirt cheap from China and mix it in to any sort of downer (commonly Heroin). Not only does it give it an extra 'kick', it's way cheaper than the stuff they're cutting it with so profits go up. It's literally the same thing as stepping on crack with baby laxatives. The problem arises when users go to hit their usual dosage without knowing that there's some ultrapowerful (~50x more potent than straight Heroin) fentanyl waiting for them, thus the OD.

.it honestly doesn't make sense from what I know about rarity/cost.

It's cheap as chips. You can make about 2lbs of it for ~$3-4000. That's orders of magnitude cheaper than the stuff they're cutting with it. You can also make it straight from source chemicals without actual poppy/opiod, which means you can do it anywhere, any time. Apparently it's mostly made in unregulared labs in China, then bought/shipped to Mexico where the cartels package it or use it for cutting. It's sort of like it's harder to get legit government marijuana than it is just buying a dime from Bruce down on the corner. Legit Fentanyl patches are tough to get because of regulation and scarcity, easy to get the illicit stuff.

[lolirl]

Call me a pussy but opiates aren't really recreational drugs.
How do I know?
Because people are dropping dead from phentanyl and users will still take whatever they think they're taking.

I have no first-hand experience of phentanyl tbh. Saw some warnings and stuff in the news about it but usually it's referencing the states rather than here.
They basically just said be aware that this shit exists because it's 10x stronger and can cause you to OD.

Remember when they were putting industrial glass powder in the weed?
When this type of shit happens I seriously doubt it's the doing of any dealer.
Like Relic says, it makes very little sense to fuck with your product, especially to the detriment of your clientele.
However, it's very easy for some total asshole with their own agenda to do, and if it looks like the regular stuff it's a dangerous combination.

[Oatbag]

It's been turning up in what people are purchasing as cocaine here. Other party drugs too. Seems to be where a fairly good chunk of the deaths are coming from, as heavy opiate users can mostly handle a little bit of fentanyl mixed in with their usual heroin,etc.

[Artificer]

It's been turning up in what people are purchasing as cocaine here

It's been a long ass time since I looked at anything harder than the occasional two fingers of whiskey, but I think I'd be pretty pissed if someone cut my uppers with downers, just on principle. Shitty meth in my coke, sure, but if I'm not signing up for a speedball, that's really uncool.

[relic]

Originally Posted by Artificer

The current issue apparently stems from the fact that dealers can get fentanyl/analog dirt cheap from China and mix it in to any sort of downer (commonly Heroin). Not only does it give it an extra 'kick', it's way cheaper than the stuff they're cutting it with so profits go up. It's literally the same thing as stepping on crack with baby laxatives. The problem arises when users go to hit their usual dosage without knowing that there's some ultrapowerful (~50x more potent than straight Heroin) fentanyl waiting for them, thus the OD.



It's cheap as chips. You can make about 2lbs of it for ~$3-4000. That's orders of magnitude cheaper than the stuff they're cutting with it. You can also make it straight from source chemicals without actual poppy/opiod, which means you can do it anywhere, any time. Apparently it's mostly made in unregulared labs in China, then bought/shipped to Mexico where the cartels package it or use it for cutting. It's sort of like it's harder to get legit government marijuana than it is just buying a dime from Bruce down on the corner. Legit Fentanyl patches are tough to get because of regulation and scarcity, easy to get the illicit stuff.

If that is the case then I don't believe that the local media in Ohio are sensationalizing the problem. We have a crazy, crazy heroin problem here. They say most of the ODs in the past six months of been people unknowingly shooting up fentynal...

btw: the worst thing coke is cut with is fucking baby laxative....nothing like doing a half gram gagger in the stall in the men's room at the club then having to run back in from the dance floor five minutes later to ass blast your dinner against the back wall of the toilet...

[Artificer]

Yeah, I remember the news reports about Columbus back a couple of months ago. Rough stuff. I'm not link-privileged yet (damn the aristocracy and their continued stranglehold on the rights of the common worker! Down with the link-privileged swine! Rise up, my brothers, and take back the intertubes!), but most of what I've regurgitated here came from a really comprehensive NPR report on Fentanyl-related deaths I heard a month or so ago. It's worth a quick google search, if only to understand the supply chain and how it's getting where it is.

As to the long term viability, I have no idea. I guess to a dealer, there'll always be another addict. Killing off a couple in the name of more cash is just par for the course. Lacing your stuff with even deadlier stuff seems like a losing proposition, but I guess there's some real world Darwinism going down. It also sounds like it's cut up from the source (Mexico, etc), and there's probably not a lot the street level guys can do about it.

And I totally feel you on the laxative. More than one fun night's been ruined that way.

[liquid_air]

Manufacturing pharmaceuticals properly requires a lot of skill and knowledge. Both missing in the case of illicit drugs, not to mention quality control or even a modicum of care for those individuals consuming the product. So, it's Russian roulette every time around.

A while back MPPP was used to cut heroin. A side product in the manufacturing under poorly controlled conditions is the neurotoxin MPTP. Turns out, MPTP is really toxic to dopaminergic neurons in the substantia nigra. The symptoms are practically identical to Parkinson's disease, which is caused by an autoimmune condition targeting those very same dopaminergic neurons. So, lots of addicts in their twenties showed up with full blown Parkinson's.

If you know a thing or two about chemistry, you can see why you'd want to be careful about one step in the synthetic sequence. It just provides another example of the callous disregard these criminal elements show towards their victims. Fentanyl is cheap, but really hard to dose, due to its potency. I wish US drug policy would recognize it as a medical problem, not solely a law enforcement question. After all, possession is only a crime because society chose to say so. It seems we have learned nothing from prohibition.

[envelope3]

I find it hard to believe that drug dealers would want to kill off their clientele. Doesn't sound too great for profits if your customer base is dead.

And what the hell is with it showing up in stuff being sold as cocaine? Seems like it would be the opposite of the desired effect.

It certainly feels sinister. Seems like every week there's some tragic story about some recreational users dropping dead.

Personally I find the idea of opiates scary enough on their own that I have no interest anyways. But seriously, this is next level frightening.

I think society would be better off with legal and regulated access to all kinds of recreational drugs. The demand is not going away. We can't possibly be better off with the market being controlled by organized crime.

For the record, there's no crazier drug than booze, and that is not only legal but encouraged. Talk about a gateway drug. Haha

Sent from my SM-G925W8 using Tapatalk

[Oatbag]

Yea I don't get having a synthetic opiate being added to a stimulant, but supposedly it's a thing.

[RFJ]

Yeah, I see it all the time. Just recently in fact we've had a few former clients die that had left the place that I work "against advice." One just happened a few days ago. Tragic, great kid he was. In all the cases it was reported back to us that it was the result of a lowered tolerance due to being sober for several months and the fact that it was cut with Fentanyl.

The guys we take in commonly arrive after a run of OD's in their circle. I have no way of verifying this but they usually report heroin cut with fentanyl as the cause. Wish these guys could understand, it truly is life and death out there these days, especially for the common IV user.

[Vault O)))]

I feel extremely fortunate to not have to deal with any of that.

[mnkvolcno]

Originally Posted by liquid_air

If you know a thing or two about chemistry, you can see why you'd want to be careful about one step in the synthetic sequence. It just provides another example of the callous disregard these criminal elements show towards their victims. Fentanyl is cheap, but really hard to dose, due to its potency. I wish US drug policy would recognize it as a medical problem, not solely a law enforcement question. After all, possession is only a crime because society chose to say so. It seems we have learned nothing from prohibition.

Yea. I'm in a relationship with a recovering heroin addict and word on the street is that dealers fuck up the dosage due to its extreme potency. If you've ever done LSD you might have noticed how much variation there is in the potency of a "hit". I think it's probably the same situation as fentanyl. When you're dealing with micrograms, you really have to be on your shit to dose properly. My SO's dealer was a pill head so yea.. It's a miracle she's alive.

[AetherSound]

the problem with fentanyl is that the dosage range is so small, a grain of salt or two being the active dose

[jbvdb493]

I was given fentanyl when I had my accident last spring, it was intra oral and kinda fun.
Followed by intra veinous morphene and a ton of codein after surgery
Opioids are fun, no wonder people die from them!

[fidelium]

Originally Posted by lolirl

Call me a pussy but opiates aren't really recreational drugs.
How do I know?
Because people are dropping dead from phentanyl and users will still take whatever they think they're taking.

I have no first-hand experience of phentanyl tbh. Saw some warnings and stuff in the news about it but usually it's referencing the states rather than here.
They basically just said be aware that this shit exists because it's 10x stronger and can cause you to OD.

Remember when they were putting industrial glass powder in the weed?
When this type of shit happens I seriously doubt it's the doing of any dealer.
Like Relic says, it makes very little sense to fuck with your product, especially to the detriment of your clientele.
However, it's very easy for some total asshole with their own agenda to do, and if it looks like the regular stuff it's a dangerous combination.

pussy

[Jaded]

I feel that anyone who would take hard opiates for fun is in a very bad environment. I know that's been true among people in my life who've abused opiates or other prescription drugs. Either psychological issues, or living arrangements, personal relationships, etc...

Totally agree with lol that there are some unscrupulous cunts on this planet too. I think some of the, are even cops. We notice it living in the city. It always seems that when there's a big event or holiday period coming up all of a sudden the streets are full of heroin and the homeless people are off the main streets and passed out in alleys. Then coincidentally it dries up the week after and every night you hear the screaming.

I reckon that's why I don't go for the opiates. Everything I've tried, even in low or prescribed doses, I always feel so shit afterwards. Sore joints, splitting headache, shit so hard my ass tears while I cry...

That's not recreational.

[fidelium]

just wanted to say that i agree with both of you lolirl and jaded. lolirl told me to call him a pussy so i did because i thought it would be funny. but yes: opiates are awful and kill people and destroy lives and almost killed me too. i steer way the fuck away from opiates. the addiction is mental. wait no, it's PHYSICAL, but i mean mental as in it's extreme and fucking murderous. never again. there's nothing fun about it. it's all just a form of suicide.

stay away from that shit. it's bad for you. there is no reward. it will not take away your pain. and it will create more.

i was addicted to oxycontin and dilaudid if that helps anyone's perspective. it's been nearly ten years. happy to be alive.