Making a melody with only sharps and flats.
You are Unregistered, please register to gain Full access.    
Advertisements


Reply
Thread Tools
Old 03-07-2016, 12:29 AM   #1
RaymondLeggs
Analog Lurker
RaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really nice
Posts: 78
MC Status: 410
Thanks: 7
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Is making medlodies/ tracks using pretty much only sharps and flats musically correct?

for some reason i cant get a lot of note progressions to not sound too bright/happy if i dont.

I have acquired an actual MIDI keyboard for the first time in five years, and i also bought a chord book also bought one for an electric guitar i haven't played since 2008 Im trying to re-learn/learn new chord progressions, but i cant get it to stick.

I know better than to Cram all my studies all in like i did in college.

I usually do progressive house/ trance 2.0 and some ambient/ break beats and stuff.

Advertisements

RaymondLeggs is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2016, 01:21 AM   #2
oly
IDMf ArtistModerator
oly is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MC
oly's Avatar
socialism twitter
Age: 26
Posts: 12,112
MC Status: 471669951
Thanks: 2,870
Thanked 2,412 Times in 1,661 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Sharps OR flats. Generally it's incorrect notation to have both.

A B C D E F G = A minor
A B C# D E F G# = A Major
A B C# D E F Ab = why are there two As?

If you look on notation, usually keys are indicated by number of sharps or flats, so two sharps in this case would be A Maj.

That said:

Things sounds ok playing only black keys because there's only five black keys and it thus creates a pentatonic scale.

Anything can be musically 'correct' depending on context and how you notate it. Don't worry about being 'correct'. Worry about whether it really sounds good, and if you're limiting your creative potential by sticking to essentially one scale.
oly is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2016, 01:24 AM   #3
RaymondLeggs
Analog Lurker
RaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really nice
Posts: 78
MC Status: 410
Thanks: 7
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

never took the pentatonic scale into context of what i am doing lol.
RaymondLeggs is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2016, 01:27 AM   #4
oly
IDMf ArtistModerator
oly is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MColy is a savage MC
oly's Avatar
socialism twitter
Age: 26
Posts: 12,112
MC Status: 471669951
Thanks: 2,870
Thanked 2,412 Times in 1,661 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

I can't remember if it makes THE pentatonic scale, but essentially any scale with five notes could be call pentatonic, as penta = 5 and tonic = tones/notes

Generally tho, of course, people mean the pentatonic as you'd learn it for guitar, 1 b3 4 5 7.
oly is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2016, 01:28 AM   #5
relic
IDMf Supporter
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 16,412
MC Status: 8508180
Thanks: 9,836
Thanked 6,345 Times in 4,551 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaymondLeggs View Post
never took the pentatonic scale into context of what i am doing lol.
fwiw there isn't just THE pentatonic scale there are many. Many Eastern scales are pentatonic. That is a quick way to make anything sound "Asian". I work with pentatonic scales quite often. Well, I should say I work with only five notes quite often.

------------------
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2016, 03:15 AM   #6
semitg
Learning The Ropes
semitg will become famous soon enough
Posts: 3
MC Status: 60
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Also the pentatonic scale is a good way to make things sound "chanty". There are a lot songs & also nursery rhyme type things out there that only use the black keys. There is an interesting Chilly Gonzales video about this subject I saw not too long ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by relic View Post
fwiw there isn't just THE pentatonic scale there are many. Many Eastern scales are pentatonic. That is a quick way to make anything sound "Asian". I work with pentatonic scales quite often. Well, I should say I work with only five notes quite often.
semitg is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to semitg
RaymondLeggs (03-11-2016)
Old 03-11-2016, 10:05 AM   #7
vashima
vashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MC
vashima's Avatar
Pocatello, Idaho
Age: 28
Posts: 677
MC Status: 13410
Thanks: 1,111
Thanked 268 Times in 206 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

to the op:

Also, depending on which key you are in, a number of white keys are notated as sharp or flat. In any scale, you will have one of each letter, for example: A,B,C,D,E,F,G which is an "A Natural Minor Scale". You aren't going to create less bright/happy progressions by using all flats or sharps, necessarily. It's all about the relationship the 7 tones in the scale you're using have. Granted, using non diatonic chords and adding non chord tones (wether they are black keys or not) will help you achieve some darker progressions. This isn't in opposition to advice already given, just an addition from another perspective. Using notes that are "sharper" or "flatter" substitutionally with diatonic notes found in Major and Natural Minor scales/Keys can certainly give you the option to less bright/happy progressions.
vashima is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to vashima
RaymondLeggs (03-11-2016)
Old 03-11-2016, 06:46 PM   #8
RaymondLeggs
Analog Lurker
RaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really niceRaymondLeggs is just really nice
Posts: 78
MC Status: 410
Thanks: 7
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vashima View Post
to the op:

Also, depending on which key you are in, a number of white keys are notated as sharp or flat. In any scale, you will have one of each letter, for example: A,B,C,D,E,F,G which is an "A Natural Minor Scale". You aren't going to create less bright/happy progressions by using all flats or sharps, necessarily. It's all about the relationship the 7 tones in the scale you're using have. Granted, using non diatonic chords and adding non chord tones (wether they are black keys or not) will help you achieve some darker progressions. This isn't in opposition to advice already given, just an addition from another perspective. Using notes that are "sharper" or "flatter" substitutionally with diatonic notes found in Major and Natural Minor scales/Keys can certainly give you the option to less bright/happy progressions.
okay, I definately need to brush up on my theory, And work harder on learning my chords, formally.
I dont plan on learning all 500 or so that is n the book, im starting off with the "magic chords".
RaymondLeggs is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-12-2016, 06:27 AM   #9
vashima
vashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MCvashima is a savage MC
vashima's Avatar
Pocatello, Idaho
Age: 28
Posts: 677
MC Status: 13410
Thanks: 1,111
Thanked 268 Times in 206 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaymondLeggs View Post
okay, I definately need to brush up on my theory, And work harder on learning my chords, formally.
I dont plan on learning all 500 or so that is n the book, im starting off with the "magic chords".
I feel you on that buddy. There are tons and tons of chord variations. I would def start with the magic ones as well and just experiment with all sorts of chords. Like it was said earlier, look for what sounds good.
vashima is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2016, 06:30 PM   #10
Vir.ull
Learning The Ropes
Vir.ull is on a distinguished road
Vir.ull's Avatar
Posts: 5
MC Status: 10
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

I am almost done completing a Music Education major, so I would say I know theory pretty well. I also studied classical and jazz piano for 14+ years.

Theory can help in SO many ways, but it can also become a distraction. Let me make a suggestion:

Think of scales as simply collections of notes. The "major" scale (or Ionian mode) is just a particular sequence of halfsteps and wholesteps (wwhwwwh) that early composer found to be pleasing. Thinking of scales as a collection of notes/a sequence of halfsteps and wholesteps can help you find the notes that give a melody/riff the partiular sound you want without having to go into detail about whether it's "right or wrong"

Just a suggestion.

Learning theory to some level will obviously still be helpful, but don't wait till you've mastered it to start making great music.
Vir.ull is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 04:26 AM   #11
Kyrpto
Soundwave Mangler
Kyrpto is a jewel in the roughKyrpto is a jewel in the roughKyrpto is a jewel in the roughKyrpto is a jewel in the rough
Posts: 180
MC Status: 310
Thanks: 8
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vashima View Post
to the op:

Also, depending on which key you are in, a number of white keys are notated as sharp or flat. In any scale, you will have one of each letter, for example: A,B,C,D,E,F,G which is an "A Natural Minor Scale". You aren't going to create less bright/happy progressions by using all flats or sharps, necessarily. It's all about the relationship the 7 tones in the scale you're using have. Granted, using non diatonic chords and adding non chord tones (wether they are black keys or not) will help you achieve some darker progressions. This isn't in opposition to advice already given, just an addition from another perspective. Using notes that are "sharper" or "flatter" substitutionally with diatonic notes found in Major and Natural Minor scales/Keys can certainly give you the option to less bright/happy progressions.
What do you mean by a number of white keys are notated as sharp or flat? I mean technically F can be thought of as E# and C and be thought of as B# (and vice versa with flats). I know some keys are noted that way for consistency purposes if that's what you mean.
Kyrpto is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2016, 06:22 AM   #12
mnkvolcno
Savage Mad Cunt
mnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MC
mnkvolcno's Avatar
Posts: 1,281
MC Status: 24810
Thanks: 473
Thanked 496 Times in 363 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyrpto View Post
What do you mean by a number of white keys are notated as sharp or flat? I mean technically F can be thought of as E# and C and be thought of as B# (and vice versa with flats). I know some keys are noted that way for consistency purposes if that's what you mean.
yes that's what he means.

for instance Gb major.

Gb Ab Bb Cb Db Eb F

though B is the same tone as Cb You will never have a major scale with 2 notes in a row that have the same letter name. (in this case you would have Bb followed by B..)

it makes more sense when you read music. It would be extremely awkward to right Cb as B in this key becaused you'd have all these B's and they'd all have to have flats or natural signs in front of them so you could tell which was which. Kind of defeats the purpose of key signatures.

------------------
mnkvolcno is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2016, 11:44 AM   #13
DJyamusic
Regular Freak
DJyamusic will become famous soon enough
israel
Age: 17
Posts: 20
MC Status: 60
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Making melodies with only sharps and flats is another way of saying making melodies on pentatonic scale
That just gave me the idea to compose on pentatonic thx !!!
DJyamusic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Currently Listening To: Hayake - Jagerchrist
Old 06-01-2016, 08:32 PM   #14
Luke_Nukem
Granular Poster
Luke_Nukem is just really niceLuke_Nukem is just really niceLuke_Nukem is just really niceLuke_Nukem is just really nice
Posts: 63
MC Status: 360
Thanks: 1
Thanked 7 Times in 3 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Only play the black keys on the piano and it will sound a bit asiany!

Someone mentioned the Chilly Gonzales video, he actually has quite a few interesting educational videos, but think this is the one you were talking about. youtube dot com/watch?v=YjntoaBl-NI
Luke_Nukem is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2016, 01:40 AM   #15
Son of Akira
IDMf Artist
Son of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MCSon of Akira is a savage MC
Son of Akira's Avatar
over yonder, behind them old railroad tracks
Posts: 1,319
MC Status: 47684920
Thanks: 318
Thanked 362 Times in 259 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Aye, playing black keys will form the major or minor pentatonic depending where you start, F# or Eb, consequently forming a chunk of a major and natural minor scale.

The main reason you get so many versatile and pleasant melodies from these (black key melodies) is that they avoid the dissonances that are delicate to handle, the tritone and minor second mainly, while still exploring a sizable range of a diatonic scale and the semi-dissonant intervals..

(likewise, there can be a dramatic juxtaposition with having one voice/instrument/sound play just the pentatonic and later another harmonize the diatonic triads. introducing the non-black-key steps to form the natural triads V and iii, or v and VI, can be striking, as suddenly these common intervals sound strange and invigorating behind an established pentatonic melody. this might be getting outside the scope of this thread but i recommend trying it; it's almost an auditory illusion to make a diatonic step sound chromatic)

The other good thing about 'the black key scales' (and for that matter the white key scales, C major and A natural minor) is non-classically trained musicians, especially using a DAW, tend to keep track of them much easier, just in terms of visualization and transcribing.

------------------
Son of Akira is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Son of Akira
Crude_beats (06-20-2016)
Old 06-16-2016, 06:10 AM   #16
Emmanuel G.
Analog Lurker
Emmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond reputeEmmanuel G. has a reputation beyond repute
Posts: 95
MC Status: 2160
Thanks: 20
Thanked 43 Times in 26 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

getting out of your comfort zone is a great way to innovate on your music.

I really dislike, for myself, using a limited set of notes, or a given key, many times in a row.

If the harmonies and melodies I find are in a key I've already used, I tend to transpose.

Different keys bring different moods, so that's interesting too.
Emmanuel G. is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2016, 04:51 PM   #17
SadSandwich
Minor Glitch
SadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to beholdSadSandwich is a splendid one to behold
Plano, TX
Posts: 30
MC Status: 760
Thanks: 0
Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

It can be extremely correct to only use sharps or flats, but it can also because used to clash with other notes in a musically correct way. Using sharp/flat notes because they are in the proper key is musically correct; using them when they are not in the correct key is musically correct. Dissonance is just as correct as harmony in music.
SadSandwich is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2016, 03:22 AM   #18
jimmusician
Deep Underground
jimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond reputejimmusician has a reputation beyond repute
jimmusician's Avatar
Posts: 770
MC Status: 8598
Thanks: 52
Thanked 67 Times in 57 Posts
Re: Making a melody with only sharps and flats.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaymondLeggs View Post
Is making medlodies/ tracks using pretty much only sharps and flats musically correct?

for some reason i cant get a lot of note progressions to not sound too bright/happy if i dont.

I have acquired an actual MIDI keyboard for the first time in five years, and i also bought a chord book also bought one for an electric guitar i haven't played since 2008 Im trying to re-learn/learn new chord progressions, but i cant get it to stick.

I know better than to Cram all my studies all in like i did in college.

I usually do progressive house/ trance 2.0 and some ambient/ break beats and stuff.
The technicalities of sharp/flat notes don't mean nearly as much as if you're using scales to fit melodies to or playing off chord tones. I mean, if you're going for a noise music approach, maybe just that would matter. But for songwriting?

Or, write everything out from the key of C and when your comfy, shift all the parts up a few steps.

Advertisements

jimmusician is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote

Making a melody with only sharps and flats. Tags
lmfao
Reply


Thread Tools

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
melody help ultragoat The Studio 0 02-16-2015 06:18 PM
melody arrangement question for making house ilusi0nal Music Theory & Composition 6 05-06-2013 07:18 AM
[thac0] Sharps Injury / Disheveled split 12' Keef Baker Industrial / EBM / Power Electronics 2 12-26-2011 02:56 PM
Making a catchy melody? wolly9595 The Studio 13 11-09-2011 11:24 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:52 AM.


Electronic Music Forums

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.