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Old 27-06-2013, 08:33 PM   #21
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

Most disappointing business meeting ever.

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Old 27-06-2013, 09:53 PM   #22
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

If you donate $325 they're write a song for you and give you the rights. Thats, uh... something.
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Old 27-06-2013, 09:58 PM   #23
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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If you donate $325 they're write a song for you and give you the rights. Thats, uh... something.
Based on their awesome promo video, can I give them 325 to not write a song that'll have my artist name on it?

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Old 27-06-2013, 10:03 PM   #24
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

So it's settled then, we're not donating money?

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Old 27-06-2013, 10:04 PM   #25
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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So it's settled then, we're not donating money?
Fair guess we are leaning that way.

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Old 27-06-2013, 10:08 PM   #26
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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Based on their awesome promo video, can I give them 325 to not write a song that'll have my artist name on it?
That should be their whole business model
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Old 28-06-2013, 07:18 AM   #27
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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So it's settled then, we're not donating money?
Indeed, but are we removing this as spam under a new democratic system?
Guys?
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Old 28-06-2013, 10:06 AM   #28
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

Hi guys,
Thanks for all your comments.

Our ultimate goal is to make things fairer and empower electronic musicians. We are electronic musicians ourselves and we believe in a changing world. We are working really hard, full time and living off very little to try to make this work. We want to provide something that is needed and that will help musicians. If you think we've gotten it wrong or have suggestions as to what you need instead of what we've created please do tell us!

Just to cover some of what has been discussed;

Many people would agree the system today doesn't work. I think the best sites out there are the new ones like Bandcamp who are empowering musicians to promote themselves and sell their music independently. Personally, I believe in the future independent sales will be predominant and things will be far fairer for musicians.

We are focused on electronic music. Our goal is to provide a professional online record store with a similar layout to Beatport, that the producers have control over like Bandcamp. If you haven't seen them, check out some screen shots [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click here to register]


In the images above you'll see we have a record store front end like Beatport for DJ's to easily find music and a profile, independent sales type platform for the musician. It's like bringing Bandcamp, Soundcloud and Beatport together.

BPM Junction is similar to Bandcamp but we have some unique services like our DJ Set Builder and powerful music filter for example. In many cases DJ's are going to Beatport to find their music as they can easily search for what they are looking for.

Our service aims to attract DJ's to BPM Junction by providing a professional record store with a DJ set builder, powerful filter and lower cost tracks. This in turn supports electronic musicians to sell more music and get a fairer return. BPM Junction will be just as good as Beatport, with more services and you wont need to get signed to a label or pay anyone else to sell your music there.

DJ's aren't in most cases, going to use Bandcamp to find your electronic music as it's simply too hard to filter and find what your looking for. Bandcamp consumers are predominantly fans of music. In most electronic music, DJ's are the main purchasers and so we want to provide a platform that attracts DJ's to buy music and provides a fair and equal opportunity for electronic producers to sell their music. Our site will make it easier for fans to find music also, and the suggestion tool will support all users to find music on a broader spectrum.

Like I said, it's very important for us to provide something that people actually want. We are electronic musicians ourselves. Our vision of what this will be is something that for us we can see being very useful. If you think we need to change things, or can tell us what we are missing, or what you need we will do our best to make it happen. We have only just begun development and now is the time to make the changes to something that people really want.

The end result will has been and will be built based on what we are told is needed. Please do tell us.

Thanks guys


*I don't want to overfill this post but if you want a better idea of where I'm coming from in relation to the industry, feel free to have a look at my recent blog post [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click here to register]
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Old 28-06-2013, 03:28 PM   #29
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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Originally Posted by Kieran Bolger View Post
Hi guys,


DJ's are the main purchasers and so we want to provide a platform that attracts DJ's to buy music and provides a fair and equal opportunity for electronic producers to sell their music.
Is this an assumption on your part or is there something to back this idea?

Side note - I am not actually against what you are doing with the website - just against all people using fundraising to start a business.

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Old 28-06-2013, 03:35 PM   #30
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

Also, I'm guessing something like 50% of the people here aren't trying to sell their music to DJs. Just saying.

Not to mention the fact that just because you build it doesn't mean DJs are going to use it. TBH, my impression of DJs spinning the popular genres is that they buy the Beatport top 10 every week and call it a day. Sorry if I missed it in your response or in some of the other material, but what are you doing for your customers to draw DJs to the site to buy the music.

Once you've got the artist's membership fee...what then? I'm assuming your business model doesn't require anyone to actually buy the music for you to profit since there is a fee before anyone's sold anything.

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Old 28-06-2013, 04:29 PM   #31
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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Also, I'm guessing something like 50% of the people here aren't trying to sell their music to DJs. Just saying.

Not to mention the fact that just because you build it doesn't mean DJs are going to use it. TBH, my impression of DJs spinning the popular genres is that they buy the Beatport top 10 every week and call it a day.
That was what I got from their reply too. Actually I was thinking: prog-house/electro/dubstep. There are a lot of people who make electronic music that isn't really for the purpose of dj's - but for someone to put on after a days work; to relax with; to simply enjoy etc. In that regard, I don't see how your website helps a musician to sell their music, any differently to the current options. Yes - I'm beginning to see the benefit to prog-house/electro/dubstep producers aiming at club bangers, but beyond that...I dunno.

One of the benefits that I can see to your site is that someone who's buying music might search for a similar genre and end up purchasing another musicians music. That kind of thing doesn't happen on bandcamp & might be kinda cool. Would also be cool if one could 'find similar artists' and have a load of track previews loaded into a playlist. I could listen to a load of previews, tag the ones I liked then go back to them for more listening / purchase the album.

What would I really like right now? I kick-ass soundcloud alternative, which I would happily pay a small fee for each month. Sell additional modules like a 'Sell Track' option or a 'Stats' option where users can upgrade their account as they see fit.
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Old 28-06-2013, 04:41 PM   #32
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

^Yea. If someone did SoundCloud right...with options to sell directly from the site via PayPal I'd be in.

I'd be happy to pay a membership fee for something that I think would actually work for me. I would like something with no free memberships available. I don't think Sound Cloud would be such a pit of despair if it wasn't free. At the moment I feel like DIY is the best move for me.

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Old 28-06-2013, 05:44 PM   #33
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

Thanks guys.

I understand completely what you are saying about using fundraising to start a business. I agree on many levels also. I've seen some big time musicians and actors recently who have been using crowd funding to build funds and its not right in my opinion.

We originally wanted to avoid the crowd funding route but circumstances have caused us to go this direction. We hope we can get our idea and our values across to people who want to see a change happen in the electronic music industry. Things today are unfair to say the least and we think with the support of other artists we can make a difference.

We have conducted a large amount of research and we understand that when it comes to Techno, Tech House, House, etc - Music that is used predominantly in DJ sets - DJ's are the main consumer. We also understand however that there is a large amount of people who wish to buy music to listen to as opposed to perform with.

Our site provides an easy to use shop front end where anybody can find music easily. We provide a suggestion tool to support users to find music on a broader spectrum each time they use the site. Unlike a number of independent sites where the focus is predominantly on the independent artist, we also consider the DJ/fan. Whether DJ or fan it will be very easy for users to find the exact music genre, tempo, artist, atmosphere, key etc they are looking for.

We have some cool tools for DJ's including a DJ set builder which supports DJ's to build even better DJ sets. This tool can be found nowhere else online. The skill of track selection remains completely down to the DJ. The set builder suggests possible tracks based on the previous track added to the set builder timeline.. Without giving away too much, it's very cool

As we all know there is a huge amount of talent out there that goes unrecognized due to the current system. BPM Junction takes away those barriers to entry for all musicians. DJ's will be able to find music exclusively to Beatport and other sites that provide signed musicians only.

We are very conscious of being fair. You wouldn't believe the amount of times we have changed the model around, crunching financials and Gigabytes to try to give as much back to the musician as possible and run a website.

What we have at the moment gives both a free option and some paid options. For no charge you can host three of your tracks at any given time. You can change the tracks whenever you want.. We have no limit on sales and we take 15% if you make a sale. If you don't make sales then no charge. All other services are free.

On the top paid plan we give 100% to the musician. We have tried to offer as much we can for as little cost to the musician as possible. All along the way we have asked musicians what they think, how fair it is and what else we can do.

We appreciate you all giving your opinions. If you could tell us what you would like, or what would really make a difference to you we would absolutely love to hear it. We can make changes now to suit needs. Please do let us know.

Thanks
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Old 28-06-2013, 06:03 PM   #34
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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Originally Posted by scyn View Post
That was what I got from their reply too. Actually I was thinking: prog-house/electro/dubstep. There are a lot of people who make electronic music that isn't really for the purpose of dj's - but for someone to put on after a days work; to relax with; to simply enjoy etc. In that regard, I don't see how your website helps a musician to sell their music, any differently to the current options. Yes - I'm beginning to see the benefit to prog-house/electro/dubstep producers aiming at club bangers, but beyond that...I dunno.

One of the benefits that I can see to your site is that someone who's buying music might search for a similar genre and end up purchasing another musicians music. That kind of thing doesn't happen on bandcamp & might be kinda cool. Would also be cool if one could 'find similar artists' and have a load of track previews loaded into a playlist. I could listen to a load of previews, tag the ones I liked then go back to them for more listening / purchase the album.

What would I really like right now? I kick-ass soundcloud alternative, which I would happily pay a small fee for each month. Sell additional modules like a 'Sell Track' option or a 'Stats' option where users can upgrade their account as they see fit.
Thank you for your comment and suggestion.

My last post just now answered some of the thoughts on fans finding music as opposed to DJ's if you'd like to take a look.

In relation to a tool for 'similar artists and genres' that is a huge part of what we do. Similar to Last.fm we will suggest what music you might like based on what you have listened to, are listening to now, or have purchased before. Unlike Bandcamp users can find their way around the site through artists, genres, friends suggestions, tempo, atmosphere etc, making for a music surfing type experience, supporting DJ's and fans to find music on a broader spectrum and musicians to sell their music.

Unlike Soundcloud you will be able to sell your music by simply uploading and adding a price to the track. You will receive stats that tell you what tracks are being listened to, how many you've sold, where in the world etc. We have been discussing providing options to allow musicians to tailor build their packages, buying only the tools they feel they need. Is this something you think would be more useful to you?

I'd love to hear what you think

If you haven't seen already the type of site and layout of the stats, record store and profile etc you can take a quick look [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click here to register]
at some screen shots of the site at the moment.

If you have any suggestions or feedback we'd love to hear from you.

Thanks a lot
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Old 28-06-2013, 06:09 PM   #35
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

So, how are you going to bring DJs and other music consumers to your website?

Or are you just hoping they stumble on your site? What's the consumer/DJ's motivation to abandon Beatport, Juno, Chemical Records or all the other well established music retailers for dance music?

It seems, to me, you've focused almost entirely on building a product to sell to dance music producers. But what are you doing to bring the customers?

It's like building a strip mall in the middle of the desert and saying rent is free, but if you make a profit we will take 15%.

You can offer all the awesome artist-side tools you want, but if you aren't really doing anything more than storing my product, what am I really getting for the percentage you take?

Also, your business model assumes that the democratization of music is all a good thing. As a DJ I'm not sure I'd want to have to dig through catalog of music where there is no quality control. At least on Juno, Chemical, Beatport...even if you don't like the genres they carry, not just anybody can upload their music. How much bad music will I have to go through before I find that one diamond in the rough? If it's anything like digging through Sound Cloud, I think most DJs (most of who work day jobs) would rather depend on the big evil music system culling the herd.

I'm really not trying to tear you down (though I'll admit I made some rude comments earlier, sorry, I get carried away sometimes), I work for several of my family's small businesses.

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Old 28-06-2013, 07:38 PM   #36
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

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So, how are you going to bring DJs and other music consumers to your website?

Or are you just hoping they stumble on your site? What's the consumer/DJ's motivation to abandon Beatport, Juno, Chemical Records or all the other well established music retailers for dance music?

It seems, to me, you've focused almost entirely on building a product to sell to dance music producers. But what are you doing to bring the customers?

It's like building a strip mall in the middle of the desert and saying rent is free, but if you make a profit we will take 15%.

You can offer all the awesome artist-side tools you want, but if you aren't really doing anything more than storing my product, what am I really getting for the percentage you take?

Also, your business model assumes that the democratization of music is all a good thing. As a DJ I'm not sure I'd want to have to dig through catalog of music where there is no quality control. At least on Juno, Chemical, Beatport...even if you don't like the genres they carry, not just anybody can upload their music. How much bad music will I have to go through before I find that one diamond in the rough? If it's anything like digging through Sound Cloud, I think most DJs (most of who work day jobs) would rather depend on the big evil music system culling the herd.

I'm really not trying to tear you down (though I'll admit I made some rude comments earlier, sorry, I get carried away sometimes), I work for several of my family's small businesses.
That's no problem man, I appreciate you asking important questions and sharing your thoughts.

The model we propose at the moment allows the users of the site to decide what music is good and what isn't. The community will have the ability to rate every track on the site. Like up and down votes on Imgur and other sites, the community decides on the content that is of value.

It will be in the interest of the artists to upload music they have completed to their fullest ability and/or alternatively learn from being down voted to the bottom and do some more work before uploading again.

We have thought about this a lot and this we feel will be the best model at the moment. We are open to ideas or suggestions from anyone who has thoughts in this respect. We don't want to push unsigned artists out as there is plenty of talent to be had in unsigned artists, and we also want to keep a good level of quality control. Presently, we feel the rating system is the best way to do this.

In relation to bringing consumers to the site. This is of course a very important question. We have plans in place to bring consumers to the site but to begin to list them on a forum would be too extensive and incomprehensible in many ways without visual aid and long winded description.

The team consists of members with Bachelor of Business, Bachelor of Science and Diploma in digital marketing. We also have the support of business mentors provided by our local enterprise boards. We've worked with RIKON who are a leading research and innovation group in Ireland. We have the knowledge and ability to market and deliver the service so that musicians can sell their music but we do need the support of musicians to help us get started.

It's challenging to approach every angle through forum discussion but I hope I am more clearly presenting what we are about.

Thanks
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Old 28-06-2013, 07:42 PM   #37
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

I like the up vote/down vote idea. In a quality community based project that could work quite well. Though I feel like that could possibly be abused with bots or something--though you don't have to go into anything about how you might stop that...just thinking out loud.

I was only harping on the marketing aspect because it seemed like you were side stepping the question as I thought I'd posted about it numerous times. But you had a lot to go over here.

The more you tell us, it seems like there are some different ideas here which is a good thing.

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Old 29-06-2013, 11:12 AM   #38
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Re: New electronic music record store - Looking for Beta testers!

From what I have read this seems amazing, I would suggest a "top 100" char in each genre. One top 100 for up votes and one top 100 for songs that have sold the most etc.

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Old 29-06-2013, 12:10 PM   #39
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Re: New electronic music record store - Looking for Beta testers!

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From what I have read this seems amazing, I would suggest a "top 100" char in each genre. One top 100 for up votes and one top 100 for songs that have sold the most etc.
Thanks for your reply man

That's an interesting idea to have op 100 for each genre.. We'll definitely look into that and how it might work.

Glad to hear your interest in the site. We're actually taking Beta applications at the moment. There are a few spaces left in the first phase if you'd like to take part and be involved in discussing and suggesting tools and services for developing the final website.

Follow the [Only registered and activated users can see links. Click here to register]
if you'd like to apply for the Beta

Thanks RaidenBeats

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Old 29-06-2013, 03:43 PM   #40
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Re: Here's something I'm working on - Need your help :)

Kieran,

I'd like to ask about the features of your website with regard to how streamlined purchases will be. One of the huge advantages of Amazonmp3 and iTunes is that you don't have to enter payment information every time, you can either link your credit card directly to your account, or deposit a certain amount of money in your account to spend on music at your leisure. What sort of features will BPM Junction offer in that regard?

Other features that would drive me to purchase music off of a site like BPM Junction would be a hub where you can redownload songs you've purchased in case you need to. Also, like others have stated, a top 100 for each genre would be an easy way to find new music to buy of a certain genre.

My final question would be how long are the 'preview' clips for the track, and if the artist has any control over what part of the song is played.

Thanks!

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Kieran Bolger (01-07-2013)
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