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Old 28-08-2011, 11:33 PM   #41
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

I have only 3 return tracks on template. Small reverb, big reberb and delay. I tryed to make templates with some vst on it but that dont work for me.

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Old 29-08-2011, 09:52 AM   #42
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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Originally Posted by bushofghosts View Post
I love the session view for jamming. Im really not sure how people go about writing in arrange view or in any side scrolling program, so if someone could say a few things about that I would be very interested.

Also, apparently the whole fever ray debut album was made in ableton, which I think is awesome.
what's the problem with side scrolling? Writing is easy in Arrange, Session or both. I basically grab my template, which already has a rough song structure in Arrange (crashes, white noise etc), make some tunes in Session, and when I'm happy I shove it onto arrange, drag it all out, then start chopping sections out, and then see what variations I can come up with and work on a breakdown. You need to learn the shortcuts eg cmd L to create a loop, cmd D to duplicate etc.
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Old 29-08-2011, 09:53 AM   #43
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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I have only 3 return tracks on template. Small reverb, big reberb and delay. I tryed to make templates with some vst on it but that dont work for me.
what is the problem having VSTs on a template?
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Old 30-08-2011, 06:50 PM   #44
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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Originally Posted by mischjok View Post
The software seems to be a must-have among performing electronic musicians, yet I was wondering if you guys use the loops and lines that come with the software? Is Ableton more adecuate for performing or composing?
I am an Ableton Live PA. When I first started I loaded up with tons of vsts to run my liveset but in the last couple of years have basically reverted to using the built in instruments. The reason being is that when you use vsts, it is usually not safe to play live (as they tend to crash or use tons of resources... and when you run a dozen instruments in a track, and like me have to load/unload as you play, doom is inevitable)....

Before, to make it safe to play, I would resample the vst instruments and use ableton fx to keep the dynamics... however I came to the conclusion that by using the built in instruments, I can tweak the parameters as I play live which is far superior to simply mangling the fx. (hope that makes sense)

I'm not sure what you mean by built in loops.... but as far as performing/composing goes...

I would have to say it is superior in both. In fact a lot of times as I produce/compose I will find myself starting to groove out and use my performing techniques (I load the fx and other stuff in my default project).... which adds a lot of possibilities to producing new sounds....

in other words, I will be producing a track, and as I do that, I start to play it, and messing with the synths/using my kaoss pad like fx rack to add new parts/variations to existing parts.

The thing about ableton is that you can produce without stopping the sound so the whole process is almost like performing so as you get into it more and more and master the fx... the line between producing and performing becomes very vague.

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Old 30-08-2011, 07:20 PM   #45
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Yeah, I've never used Live live, but writing tunes is basically jamming, making up a tune as you go without stopping, until you get into Arrange and start to do stuff where you need to work on the drop or whatever.
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Old 05-09-2011, 04:28 AM   #46
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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Originally Posted by funken View Post
what's the problem with side scrolling? Writing is easy in Arrange, Session or both. I basically grab my template, which already has a rough song structure in Arrange (crashes, white noise etc), make some tunes in Session, and when I'm happy I shove it onto arrange, drag it all out, then start chopping sections out, and then see what variations I can come up with and work on a breakdown. You need to learn the shortcuts eg cmd L to create a loop, cmd D to duplicate etc.
I just find that with all side scrolling programs that Ive used (cubase, reason) you end up making a loop and then basically trying to piece things together and have to do a whole lot of linear planning in your mind thinking to yourself "now i guess for the next part I could do this, and take away this etc) but I find the session view to be much more intuitive for writing instrumental electronic music. Especially how you can basically throw a bunch of different riffs under each instrument and just mix and match until you find something you like.
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Old 05-09-2011, 09:52 AM   #47
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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Originally Posted by bushofghosts View Post
I just find that with all side scrolling programs that Ive used (cubase, reason) you end up making a loop and then basically trying to piece things together and have to do a whole lot of linear planning in your mind thinking to yourself "now i guess for the next part I could do this, and take away this etc) but I find the session view to be much more intuitive for writing instrumental electronic music. Especially how you can basically throw a bunch of different riffs under each instrument and just mix and match until you find something you like.
Yeah, definitely.
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Old 09-09-2011, 05:49 PM   #48
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Personally I dont use much sampled audio in my live setup, and it I do its something I either made or recorded.

Ive always used Live specifically for performance purposes, Ive been more than happy with Renoise's workflow, and its been so long I can't really look at a piano roll as a real creative tool But I know plenty of people who use it for everything else, and their work is plenty good, so if you find Live lets you do what you need, go for it

When I started using Live i was rendering Renoise tracks as individual 8 bar stems and sorta just going down the list, rearranging this or that, and I made a bunch of skeleton-tracks, basic outlines to play with. But that was just practicing, Ive always had the goal of being as fully live as i can manage, with as much realtime synthesis as possible. Its taken a lot of work and a lot of experimentation (no thanks to m4l) but finally Im nearly satisfied....

Renoise just has great keyboard functionality that makes it so much more fluid for writing, but it lacks proper internal MIDI, so for that theres Ableton, and i can mix finished studio tracks with it too...

So teh answer to whether o rnot its best for compositon or performance is a matter of personal preference
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:54 PM   #49
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

I use Logic in combination with Ableton. I design the sounds and write/record clips in Logic and mix each individual sound to my liking. I get a basic mix going, and from there I can extract the stems in sections of 4 or 8 bars and bring them into Ableton. I find Logic to be a much more powerful tool in terms of recording and editing. But Ableton is definitely well suited for the actual performance and makes live electronic music much more interesting.
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Old 10-09-2011, 12:21 AM   #50
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

The last month or so I have been doing this which has really improved my work quality + work flow:

Creating everything in Session view and using the relative modulation values in the Clip views for all my parameter editing. I then duplicate any sections onto new channels which require going above the relative Clip view values.

Inadvertently, this often adds another dimension of control to that part of the audio as it gives me more control over singular notes. I normally end up with having basically every single note on a different channel because of this need to go above the relative values in Clips, which has proved an amazing advantage for me!

After getting something good in Session view, I then import audio bounces into the Arrangement view for easier linear arrangements of whole sections/songs. Works like a charm for me as I often need to create several versions of loops to get decent enough ones, and the Session view keeps it clean and easy to rearrange without automation data going weird as everything is embedded in the Clips themselves.

Damn, I love Clips.
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Old 12-09-2011, 10:01 PM   #51
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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It's not, it's very easy. Most of the time you never look at the routing. Took me a while to suss all that routing out but here you have it on a plate folks! The reason I route the returns in is so they are effected as well. Especially important if you want to filter the whole track down and you have a return track with an exciter on.

Note the DELAYS at the bottom of the tracks, very useful for shifting hats or claps forward a few ms and so on.

GROOVE. Ok, quick word on groove. What I do is use Swing 16-99, and then dial in the percentage I want. I rarely 'commit'. This way, I can use it as an adjustable global groove for the whole song, and maybe increase it if I think the song needs a higher % groove.

The sidechain is from mlovers, and it is split in 3 you you can just sidechain the low end, very nifty.

The thing on the bottom left of the lower pic is called a Rack. Anything can be 'racked' and it allows you to assign 8 parameters to macros. These are then instantly controlled by the 8 knobs on your keyboard, and you can control up to 6 racks or other devices at once as per my earlier post on page 1.

You can actually control 16 parameters of a plugin by configuring 16 and racking the last 8. The first 8 are automatically controlled, and the left-right cursor gets you to the rack for the other 8. Personally I usually just rack the 8 I am mostly gonna want to tweak, once I have made my sound in the GUI of the plugin. You can then save these racks as presets. You can restrict the range each knob goes.

This involves NO MIDI MAPPING!

hint:
^^.

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Old 13-09-2011, 07:34 AM   #52
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Interesting. I found another video on that which goes into a bit more detail

I think this would be good if you wanted the in-line (not sure what the correct term is - where the effect is directly on a track) effect on more than one effect, though it will obviously use quite a few return channels up.

I mainly use 3 audio channels, one for a global submix, and two for sidechain compressors, one heavy one mild. The beauty of this is that it also allows you to freeze the tracks.
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Old 13-09-2011, 08:22 AM   #53
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

I finally learned to control feedbacks!
I now have a chain with an external effects out going to a distortion pedal, followed by another external effect, going to the same pedal, followed by a gate and a limiter.

Place it on drums, fuck shit up, then cut the feedbacks and layer them on other sounds or just leave them on your drums!

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Old 13-09-2011, 04:58 PM   #54
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

This is a great thread! I figured I'd chime in with my setup and a few questions.

I use a mix of Audio Clips, Soft Synths (mainly for live playing and looping) and MIDI Clips for external hardware.

I have one midi Channel going to my DSI Mopho and then back into ableton via the external Instrument device.

I have three midi channels going to my Nord Lead 2x (it can receive on 4 different channels at once) I leave the first channel open for me to play that synth live, outside of the box. The Audio is split into two pairs and sent to an external mixer alongside the ableton signal.

When I have the time to set it up for our set and the space available I will also setup my DSI MEK to an AUDIO IN track for looping and sound manipulation within Ableton.

At first I just used 4 Audio Tracks: Drums, Leads, Pads, and Bass. Then as my set evolved I started using grouped tracks for layering.

Bass is grouped with a sub Bass.

Drums are grouped with a second layer.

And extra melodics / rhythms are grouped in the Leads and Pads category.

I do not use the submix idea however. While I have a similar setup sending my groups to a FX chain for everything I just put that on the master and use momentary switches to turn the effects on and off.

So here is my question, what are the advantages of using the submix audio track vs how I do it and just using the master as my submix? I understand that way you can avoid sending some channels to the FX, but based on the screen shot it appears everything is going to the submix anyway?
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Old 13-09-2011, 07:28 PM   #55
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Lol! Yeah, everything goes to the submix normally so there probably is no real advantage. But, the moment I put it all on the master will by sods law coincide with the moment I want to filter the whole track except a couple of things. Plus, I have enough stuff on my master and a few things on the submix, so it keeps it clearer. Master plus on the master and global effects on the submix. I will maybe even start having a couple of submixes to vary things more one day.

How do you just have audio tracks? My drums are on about 15 midi tracks and a couple of audio tracks. Are the audio tracks loops from sample collections?
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Old 13-09-2011, 07:40 PM   #56
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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How do you just have audio tracks? My drums are on about 15 midi tracks and a couple of audio tracks. Are the audio tracks loops from sample collections?
I perform with a drummer, so the drums I have in Ableton are mainly percussion or top loops, basically to layer on top of his live kit playing.

So what do you have on your master vs your submix fx?

My master has a compressor for subtle peak limiting, a beat repeat, a reverb, an eq 8 which I control the top and bottom frequencies for hi/low pass filtering and the "fade to grey" effect.

I have momentary switches for the on/off of the repeat function of beat repeat and on/off for the reverb and fade to grey.
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Old 13-09-2011, 08:39 PM   #57
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

My master just has the mastering stuff, compression (the Glue), bit of EQ, BBE Sonic Maximiser, Pro L limiter and some measuring stuff to check loudness and dynamic range. Basically just to make it loud and tweak the eq.
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Old 17-09-2011, 01:26 PM   #58
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Is it possible to do some pad drumming on the launchpad or is it risky (I donīt know how strong the pads are).

Is it also possible to do live looping on live? Like, I set a track to record something and stop after 4 beats?
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Old 17-09-2011, 05:40 PM   #59
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

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Originally Posted by lagrangian View Post
I have a violent disposition against any existing synth patches, samples or loops that come with any piece of software or hardware. The thought that some canned piece of audio potentially winding up in the final mix of one of my albums is a huge turn off.
I make most of my own patches on my Blofeld because the ones on there generally don't vibe with me, but Space Echo captures the pad I have in my head just as good as a patch I make myself, so why reinvent the wheel?

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Old 21-09-2011, 05:15 AM   #60
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Re: So how do you use Ableton Live?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mischjok View Post
Is it possible to do some pad drumming on the launchpad or is it risky (I donīt know how strong the pads are).

Is it also possible to do live looping on live? Like, I set a track to record something and stop after 4 beats?
I do TONS of live looping. Both with the looper effect, which I have set up to do exactly as you described (Record for 4 bars then start playing back)

And I will also Arm MIDI Tracks, both external hardware and softsynths and record directly into the cells.
It's a little trickier but lets you creat multiple layers to bring in and out independtly whereas the looper just goes in one direction or the other. (adding or subtracting layers)

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