My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?
You are Unregistered, please register to gain Full access.    
Advertisements


The Studio All discussions relating to sound design, mixing techniques, music theory, composition, and gear.

Reply
Go Back » The Studio » The Studio
Thread Tools
Old 17-02-2018, 10:46 AM   #1
Bluesh1ft
Sample Destroyer
Bluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond repute
Bluesh1ft's Avatar
In another world, usually
Posts: 263
MC Status: 2710
Thanks: 116
Thanked 54 Times in 44 Posts
My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

In rant form:

On how to improve your process? I mean more of the photoshop skills type of stuff. Organizing tracks/pencil vs live. mix to audio vs keep midi. And perhaps something about the state of mind.

Firstly I am apprehensive to get too complicated. Stabs and fancy rymthms I fall apart. Its always just easier to copy pasta that last section and extend it and not put a fancy break.

Its hard for me to play live no matter what I do i can feel the lag between the key presses and the output. I dont think its a driver thing, I think its a mind thing.

Its especially discouraging if you try to make a complicated fill or section and it doesn't sound commercial.

Then I listen over and over again even though I could get through it faster by not listening to it so much.

I get distracted, my mind finds the path of least resistance and i lose some thematic and musical structure by settling for less.

I feel like I have ADD, anxiety, lazyness, etc.

I get worried that by penciling in things it will sound robotic so I offset some stuff from the grid a bit.

I feel like its a big sloppy mess. I wish I could have the confidence of those autistic type of nerds that gets things done. Granted those type of people build the buildings but they don't create the concepts.

I am missing a screw, i'm radically skeptical... skeptical of myself.

I am soooooo slow. I wish I could be one of those guys... "yeah imma flippy flap that turn this turn that switcha'roo"

I am more like this.... "hmmm doesnt sound like quality ...... research online..... I dont have super eq-osity,just use a regular eq dumb tutorial! Okay ill try to make a synth.... I'll try to make this from scratch. No this doesn't sound epic. I'll just use a preset, well it sort of works, guess it will have to do guess it wil have to do."

Its seems I cant get any momentum going. Its a fight to the end even over the most trivial of things. Why am i stuck in second gear? Why am I holding myself back? "Oh look at the time, guess Ill go play video games or watch something on youtube.I'll just refuse to push myself to improve because im convinced that certain techniques are esoteric"

Last edited by Bluesh1ft; 17-02-2018 at 10:51 AM..

Advertisements

Bluesh1ft is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17-02-2018, 01:55 PM   #2
Iyashi Sound
Knob Twiddler
Iyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond repute
Iyashi Sound's Avatar
Posts: 226
MC Status: 9310
Thanks: 205
Thanked 186 Times in 125 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

It might be that you're trying to make a kind of music you enjoy listening to, but aren't good at making.

Like for example:

I like listening to Bach's piano music, but my playing skills make it sound like shit.

or

I like the new Aphex Twin album, but I haven't got the skill or patience to create something that complex.

Lately I've been listening to old free jazz records, and the freedom to sound like shit some of the time can be really inspiring. Not that I've started playing anything that sounds like jazz, it's more just the idea - that finding out what YOU sound like is the real journey.

Aphex Twin will always be better at being Aphex Twin than I will anyway.

Personally, I'm not so worried about making something commercial any more. Only a few people ever make any real money from electronic music, so I might as well just try to have fun with it. I'll choose going on fun adventures over "trying to sell myself on social media" any day anyway.

The pressure you can put on yourself to be productive and commercial, to make so and so many tracks a month, - it sucks the fun right out of it.

It's OK to just be yourself.

Last edited by Iyashi Sound; 17-02-2018 at 03:17 PM..
Iyashi Sound is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17-02-2018, 06:48 PM   #3
mnkvolcno
Savage Mad Cunt
mnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MC
mnkvolcno's Avatar
Posts: 1,383
MC Status: 29010
Thanks: 552
Thanked 580 Times in 415 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

I’m really conciencous by nature as well. It has a positive side and a negative. So first of all, remember that, despite the frustration it can cause, it’s also a strength that you care and are willing to expect a lot out of yourself. I think every personality trait like this has a positive and negative way it can manifest. Don’t waste your time wishing you were more like someone else, try to be the best version of yourself you can be.

Now that the touchy feely part is out of the way.. im regards to actual workflow. I used to have like exactly the same issues as you do, but I’ve mostly moved past them. They flare up from time to time, and it’s still bothersome. But here is what I’ve found to help.

Priority 1= making music/ finishing tracks. Not perfection or “pro” mixes. You get better by FINISHING tracks. Can’t stress this enough.

Therefore, I recommend that you have a good order of operations for making a trakc. It’s really important for me to do the majority of the writing and arranging in the first phase. ASAP I try to lay out the track as a musical idea that’s whatever length of time I’m going for. Ideally I will do minimal sound design here, and almost no mixing. To be specific, By arranging I mean which instrument plays what and when they play it, and when the song sections change.

From there i move to sound design and finally mixing. Since I already have a 4 minute thing out in front of me, it really helps alleviate that “blank canvas” feeling. I can just focus on making it better one section at a time.

There’s more I could point out, but I could go on for way too long. I do wanna mention this though. I realized that as far as having a “pro” mix, if you choose decent sounds and arrange well, you’re going to be very close to a great mix already. I think what makes mixing so difficult is not that you have to do all this crazy shit to get a good mix (I guess sometimes you might) but more that you have to do a few things very precisely.

But honestly; mix quality is the last thing I care about when I hear music. It’d be like “wow this guy is playing the most amazing piano I’ve ever heard but I wish it was a Steinway grand and not a shitty old upright.”

Just embrace the perfect imperfection of the universe and how it manifests in you. You can take lsd to help with that.

------------------
mnkvolcno is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to mnkvolcno
ms_ (17-02-2018)
Old 17-02-2018, 09:32 PM   #4
White Noise
IDMf Artist
White Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MCWhite Noise is a savage MC
White Noise's Avatar
California
Posts: 960
MC Status: 25110
Thanks: 112
Thanked 502 Times in 358 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

I agree with mnkvolcno, finishing songs is really important, even if they don't turn out like you want. I adopted a monthly release schedule last year, which is loose enough to permit some time to work, but tight enough to force me to make decisions and finish. I also find that that move forced me to work in a parallel fashion, where I'm working on more than one song at a time. This time a year ago, it was all I could do to juggle 2 songs at once, and now I can comfortably juggle 5 or 6 songs at various stages. And that gives you a lot of freedom to take your time with a problem when you need to, as long as you have other stuff that's going okay or you have a bank of finished songs (which I also have right now, I could do nothing for two months and still not miss my release schedule). And I don't feel bad when I just have a good idea for a song and I lay it down and finish it in a 5 hour session, even if it's simple or not my best work, because I know that I have more interesting stuff to go back to.

------------------
White Noise is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17-02-2018, 11:05 PM   #5
Vault O)))
Quarter pounder McCunt
Vault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MCVault O))) is a savage MC
Florida
Age: 28
Posts: 1,415
MC Status: 52110
Thanks: 1,329
Thanked 1,042 Times in 686 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

I think I can relate to this, since I've been misdiagnosed as on the spectrum / ADHD numerous times due to how overly-analytical my brain is about everything (especially art).

As everyone else has said at this point, completing work to the best of your abilities now will translate as you learn more. I like to think of completing tracks without getting in your own way as a muscle that you can develop over time. Never scrap entirely; learn how to kill even 3/4 of the track (if need be) in order to rebuild around the original idea that you had, otherwise you'll just get really good at critiquing your original ideas, second guessing your own judgement and not much else.

Also don't take advice from me because I don't really know what I'm doing either

------------------
Vault O))) is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Vault O)))
Tsachi (19-02-2018)
Old 17-02-2018, 11:50 PM   #6
ms_
IDMf Artist
ms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MCms_ is a savage MC
ms_'s Avatar
Posts: 3,317
MC Status: 122660
Thanks: 733
Thanked 2,453 Times in 1,433 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

to be fair, it's always good to compare yourself to pros. It's quite like a self-harming but I find it as a driving force that just put me in a place. You're obviously far away from their skill level but they use computers. And you have a computer too! That means you can do it and only way to it just keep making music. Sure, motivation sometimes just goes away but a good way to reset all that is just listen to music you wish you have created. I always was a perfectionist since I started and my problem to this day is those mood shifts when one moment I like what I'm doing and the next I hate everything. I don't even know what condition that might be, but somehow I still hold my finger away from that "nuke all" button. This depends on personality but, for me, a hard slap in a face from time to time is a reason of my progress in composition and music production so comparing yourself to your top artists is almost crucial.

------------------
ms_ is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to ms_
Vault O))) (17-02-2018)
Old 18-02-2018, 09:11 AM   #7
Dokan
Analog Lurker
Dokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant future
Dokan's Avatar
Hamburg
Age: 33
Posts: 84
MC Status: 1760
Thanks: 52
Thanked 35 Times in 24 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

even while it is painful, it is totally normal to have a creative crisis from time to time...
i guess you are in the midle of reinventing yourself or better to say, starting to change the way you make music... if not, you would not have posted this... many things sounded familiar, reminded me of my own problems.

What i found out, is that breaks are so much important... taking a step back... letting it go for a while, have some days without music production or even listening to music, give your ears a rest... and: don`t expect too much from yourself if you sitting there, overly tired in the middle of the night in front of your computer...
if you want to create good stuff, try to be in a healthy and wake state of mind...

And rethink your general process and try to waste not too much time on the "wrong" things, try to invest your time wisely...

[Only registered and activated users can see links. Click here to register]


Dokan is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18-02-2018, 04:12 PM   #8
FTD
IDMf Artist
FTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MCFTD is a savage MC
FTD's Avatar
Posts: 496
MC Status: 3464855
Thanks: 57
Thanked 248 Times in 167 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

I think most of us have all been there, I still obsess over “is this good enough” and “does it sound like a proper release.”

As well as some of the great advice already mentioned you might benefit from scheduling your production time so you’re not trying to do everything at once and breaking down bigger tasks.

Ill Gates talks about this methodology and though he tries to claim it as his own, it’s fairly standard work practices applied to music production. Still, definitely worth a watch as he talks about improving work flow, timeboxing etc.


------------------
FTD is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to FTD
Bluesh1ft (25-02-2018)
Old 18-02-2018, 05:34 PM   #9
relic
IDMf SupporterIDMf ArtistModerator
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 17,763
MC Status: 8560130
Thanks: 11,157
Thanked 7,384 Times in 5,221 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

My basic answer to this is you just have to beat yourself into submission. Finish things. Fight w tunes that arent working. Dont just move on because its easier. Youll probably get frustrated, emotional, and maybe even cry (I shed a few tears some nights battling my master thesis...a sixty book page of poetry of that had to be publication quality).

------------------
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18-02-2018, 10:44 PM   #10
Focalized
Man in the box
Focalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MCFocalized is a savage MC
Focalized's Avatar
Space Base
Posts: 2,650
MC Status: 10378217
Thanks: 14
Thanked 341 Times in 271 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

I think my music is amazing.

Most people think their kids are amazing.

This is the reality that I have learned to except.

------------------
Focalized is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2018, 03:06 PM   #11
Dokan
Analog Lurker
Dokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant futureDokan has a brilliant future
Dokan's Avatar
Hamburg
Age: 33
Posts: 84
MC Status: 1760
Thanks: 52
Thanked 35 Times in 24 Posts
Icon2 Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

you asked about "videos" ... so here are some more...

especially the first one (and maybe the second) should be very useful for you!




Dokan is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 19-02-2018, 04:05 PM   #12
jbvdb493
IDMf Supporter
jbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MC
jbvdb493's Avatar
Posts: 1,965
MC Status: 32110
Thanks: 792
Thanked 642 Times in 513 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

A lot of good points on here for sure.
And videos and books etc can be a good inspiration too.
But my point is this: the first part of workflow is.... work.
You gotta work on what you want to do. And accept that sometimes you won’t come up with any “good music” and use that time to do, for example: reorganize your workspace, build your sample library, build drum kits, learn scales or chord shapes on your keyboard etc.
I am sure everyone here has been procrastinating at one point or an other, I am typing this instead of playing guitar, but it is better to spend time doing something than watching 100 YouTube videos about doing something.
One last thing. I was told that to become good at something you have to do more than do said thing, you gotta think it too. So if you are in the dumps or whatever, think about positive ideas, or new things you could work on in your studio time. Think of the next patch you want to program, or think of the notes on the scale of your song etc.
jbvdb493 is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2018, 03:00 PM   #13
relic
IDMf SupporterIDMf ArtistModerator
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 17,763
MC Status: 8560130
Thanks: 11,157
Thanked 7,384 Times in 5,221 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

No offense to the people who posted videos. Im sure they help some people. But my dad has been building websites for motivational speakers and multi level marketing people for decades...its all the same basic shit repackaged over and over.

Dont waste time with videos. As JVB suggests the most important part of workflow is work. Bulldoze through and do the work.

------------------
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2018, 04:33 PM   #14
mnkvolcno
Savage Mad Cunt
mnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MC
mnkvolcno's Avatar
Posts: 1,383
MC Status: 29010
Thanks: 552
Thanked 580 Times in 415 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Lol. We really went to town on this thread but OP has disappeared. I hope he didn’t throw in the towel! :/

------------------
mnkvolcno is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20-02-2018, 06:42 PM   #15
relic
IDMf SupporterIDMf ArtistModerator
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 17,763
MC Status: 8560130
Thanks: 11,157
Thanked 7,384 Times in 5,221 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mnkvolcno View Post
Lol. We really went to town on this thread but OP has disappeared. I hope he didn’t throw in the towel! :/
Hopefully he ran off motivated! But I see that user pop up now and again : ) They will be back I think...

------------------
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 25-02-2018, 02:09 PM   #16
Bluesh1ft
Sample Destroyer
Bluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond reputeBluesh1ft has a reputation beyond repute
Bluesh1ft's Avatar
In another world, usually
Posts: 263
MC Status: 2710
Thanks: 116
Thanked 54 Times in 44 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Thanks guys for all the great responses

Yeah I disappeared lol. I tend to go through cycles of determined>frustrated>helpless>pissed>determined>. ... and I got back on the determined train a little bit after I made the thread.... I want to try to never leave the determined train. The more quality time I give to my work time, the more results I will see. I gotta stop looking behind me and try and push through the skepticism.

I guess skepticism is a mixed blessing. It can create doubt in your own abilities but I think it can also be used as a tool to sharpen your skills.

I also need to stop taking shortcuts... I've held off some sorely needed practice and learning in certain areas. My ears are telling me that my shortcuts or lack of development aren't cutting the mustard. I cant just think things into existence I have to use the interface we've been given in the world.

Anything worth creating requires perseverance and hard work. I have to stop being my own worst enemy.
Bluesh1ft is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to Bluesh1ft
Iyashi Sound (26-02-2018)
Old 26-02-2018, 04:09 AM   #17
relic
IDMf SupporterIDMf ArtistModerator
relic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MCrelic is a savage MC
relic's Avatar
The AK Rowdy Rowdy
Posts: 17,763
MC Status: 8560130
Thanks: 11,157
Thanked 7,384 Times in 5,221 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesh1ft View Post

I also need to stop taking shortcuts... I've held off some sorely needed practice and learning in certain areas. My ears are telling me that my shortcuts or lack of development aren't cutting the mustard. I cant just think things into existence I have to use the interface we've been given in the world.
This was a great enemy of mine for many years, but I’ve also stopped doing some things I used to take as gospel and its improved my work. I think the take away is to know there is no “one process” really, to always be open minded, to always be a student and a teacher and to feel blessed and awed whent the universe presents you with a creative situation in which you get to employ the exception instead of the rule.

------------------
relic is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 26-02-2018, 03:29 PM   #18
Iyashi Sound
Knob Twiddler
Iyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond reputeIyashi Sound has a reputation beyond repute
Iyashi Sound's Avatar
Posts: 226
MC Status: 9310
Thanks: 205
Thanked 186 Times in 125 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesh1ft View Post
Anything worth creating requires perseverance and hard work. .
Hard work and perseverance isn't everything.

hmm..

Determination is about "wanting to see things through to the end", isn't it?

But since creativity by it's very nature is open-ended or "undetermined", if you determinately set a certain goal or endpoint for your own creativity, you create a "Catch-22" problem: You don't know what you want, but you're determined to get it.

Since that obviously won't work, you start limiting the scope of your imagination to what you already know and recognise as "musical ideas" instead, - bypassing anything that doesn't match those criteria. As a result, creativity and determination end up opposing each other.

I call this: "being stuck in the same old ideas".

In order to allow yourself to get truly original ideas, - you first need to let go of wanting to have them (since you don't even know what they are). You might even say, that you need to allow yourself not to know what music or art is, which can almost seem like an insult to your ego.

But if you allow your ego to say: "I know what music is already, now I just need to work hard and persevere", then what you're doing is limiting yourself creatively.

Now, I'm not saying that hard work and perseverance aren't useful tools, but they're not useful until AFTER you've had an idea.

If you don't know what you're doing, hard work is meaningless.

Last edited by Iyashi Sound; 26-02-2018 at 03:39 PM..
Iyashi Sound is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 26-02-2018, 06:16 PM   #19
mnkvolcno
Savage Mad Cunt
mnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MCmnkvolcno is a savage MC
mnkvolcno's Avatar
Posts: 1,383
MC Status: 29010
Thanks: 552
Thanked 580 Times in 415 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iyashi Sound View Post
Hard work and perseverance isn't everything.

hmm..

Determination is about "wanting to see things through to the end", isn't it?

But since creativity by it's very nature is open-ended or "undetermined", if you determinately set a certain goal or endpoint for your own creativity, you create a "Catch-22" problem: You don't know what you want, but you're determined to get it.

Since that obviously won't work, you start limiting the scope of your imagination to what you already know and recognise as "musical ideas" instead, - bypassing anything that doesn't match those criteria. As a result, creativity and determination end up opposing each other.

I call this: "being stuck in the same old ideas".

In order to allow yourself to get truly original ideas, - you first need to let go of wanting to have them (since you don't even know what they are). You might even say, that you need to allow yourself not to know what music or art is, which can almost seem like an insult to your ego.

But if you allow your ego to say: "I know what music is already, now I just need to work hard and persevere", then what you're doing is limiting yourself creatively.

Now, I'm not saying that hard work and perseverance aren't useful tools, but they're not useful until AFTER you've had an idea.

If you don't know what you're doing, hard work is meaningless.
you're talking about the zen concept of beginners mind. Definitely the goal to have this mindset.

I do think that one has to go through a learning period in which they are almost practicing as opposed to creating. in other words, there may be a considerable period of time in which people do have to rely on determination and perseverance as they develop their process. Once they don't have to think so much about what theyre doing and they have more confidence in theit skills is when i would suggest trying to let go of doing what you think you should do.

I kind of think people should force themselves to finish tracks until it becomes second nature. Then you will reach a point where you're not asking "can i finsh this track?" but "do i want to finish this track?" At this point, after you have laid some framework for your workflow, you can step back a bit and start shooting from the hip more. I definitely agree with what IS is saying here, but I do think that if you are too focused on not being creative enough before you've done the grunt work of creating your workflow, you might be too disjointed to get anything done.

Making electronic music is an interesting thing when you compare it to learning an instrument or traditional composing. In those two disciplines, it is expected that the musician will spend a large amount of time practicing and studying, before they are able to really "create" anything. But as electronic musicians, we expect ourselves to just sit down and make a track, when maybe we've only just started this journey.

One thing I suggest to all my music students, is to have a mental separation between practice and play. I think it's important to do both with anything. Like on guitar (main thing I teach), you spend a certain portion of your time consciously working on things that you are unfamiliar with, and then a certain amount of time just letting it all hang out, not putting pressure on yourself to do anything in particular, and letting your mind freely play with whatever ideas you come upon. I think by consciously separating the two, you can get more out of each. Its easy to slip into a state of "half practicing, half playing", which can lead to feeling like you didn't really do what you were "supposed" to do, and at the same time, didn't really have fun just creating music.

I think it's important to recreate this situation with electronic music too. Allow yourself some time where you are being technically minded and focusing on learning and building on your strengths and weaknesses. But also allow yourself just to clear your mind and go for it, without a particular goal in mind, and without criticizing yourself.

------------------
mnkvolcno is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 27-02-2018, 12:02 AM   #20
jbvdb493
IDMf Supporter
jbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MCjbvdb493 is a savage MC
jbvdb493's Avatar
Posts: 1,965
MC Status: 32110
Thanks: 792
Thanked 642 Times in 513 Posts
Re: My Process Is Terrible: Any good vids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iyashi Sound View Post
Hard work and perseverance isn't everything.

hmm..

Determination is about "wanting to see things through to the end", isn't it?

But since creativity by it's very nature is open-ended or "undetermined", if you determinately set a certain goal or endpoint for your own creativity, you create a "Catch-22" problem: You don't know what you want, but you're determined to get it.

Since that obviously won't work, you start limiting the scope of your imagination to what you already know and recognise as "musical ideas" instead, - bypassing anything that doesn't match those criteria. As a result, creativity and determination end up opposing each other.

I call this: "being stuck in the same old ideas".

In order to allow yourself to get truly original ideas, - you first need to let go of wanting to have them (since you don't even know what they are). You might even say, that you need to allow yourself not to know what music or art is, which can almost seem like an insult to your ego.

But if you allow your ego to say: "I know what music is already, now I just need to work hard and persevere", then what you're doing is limiting yourself creatively.

Now, I'm not saying that hard work and perseverance aren't useful tools, but they're not useful until AFTER you've had an idea.

If you don't know what you're doing, hard work is meaningless.
I am gonna disagree with some of this.
Now the part I agree is that you can’t say “I am gonna make a death metal album” if you hate metal.
That you can’t force your voice, and that artistically it’s a process of discovery.

But thinking about a goal and doing nothing is dreaming.
Thinking about a goal and just plinking away I still aimless.
Thinking about a goal, setting realistic measures to reach that goal and setting timelines is a road map to getting to that goal.

So saying I wanna be famous is a dream.
Saying I want to work on an ep is a goal.
Saying that I want to write a track per week for 6 weeks is a road map.

Advertisements

jbvdb493 is offline   Thanks Reply With Quote
Thanks to jbvdb493
Iyashi Sound (27-02-2018)
Reply


Thread Tools

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Who Was BlackBurst? AstroIDMist? NystagmusE? Etc? WTF? Daggit Introduce Yourself 0 04-11-2017 06:43 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:21 AM.


Electronic Music Forums

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.