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Old 09-11-2015, 06:58 AM   #21
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

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Originally Posted by relic View Post
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I really just wanted to hear more from you, I wasnt disagreeing or being sarcastic. I have no snappy comeback of any kind.
Yeah I know. I'm just saying have a go at doing the maths and see what you can come up with.

And honestly, (not you) but half the time it's not worth saying things around here about production. Too many people like to just argue with me because I said something. Like if I said the sky was blue, brb would tell me how I'm obviously too mad cunt to see that it's not.

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Though there is the benefit of being able to process the compressed/uncompressed signal seperately if you use the mixer instead just a wet/dry knob. Other than that I cant see one. I try to keep things pretty simple in my mixes though, so I probably wouldnt use this anyway.
Yeah, to me it's about avoiding complexity. One thing to be clear, I never said don't use a parallel process. I said evaluate whether there is any benefit to adding complexity. In the majority of instances (particularly when you're dealing with electronic music) there's no benefit unless you like doing more work for the same result.

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Originally Posted by brb View Post
Well, for example, applying wildly or subtly complex compression to a single signal, say mastering or effecting a channel group (or your own example of a signal with wildly ranging dynamics). Those numbers were just the ones that came to mind and that seemed most complicated to average out on a single compressor, and highlighted how it would be quite difficult to get a single compressor to behave like two wildly different states at once.
Translation: I don't actually have an answer so I'll just repeat what Jaded said because he obviously understands what he just said.

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We're not just using compressors like an electrical engineer would calibrate a fridge, so I don't see why you keep banging on about gain reduction.
Translation: I also have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about. And what? People use audio compressors to calibrate refrigerators?

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Derp. Minus 2 more troll points.
I like that you scored yourself in this post. I also like how predictable you are. Of all of the people who troll me on IDMf you are the one I can rely on to consistently take opposition to everything I said, just because I said it. Something I said obviously made you feel stupid once.

But thank you for not answering the questions. Whenever you troll me, your posts are always so informative and helpful.

And yes, if you want to be pedantic multi-band compression is parallel compression. However, I suspect the majority of people I know who know what they're talking about wouldn't reach for a multi-band compressor if I said "let's do some parallel compression brah!"

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You're very welcome, and slightly mental.
Yes, and now you've taken to talking to yourself. But thanks for the incoherent diatribe.

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Old 09-11-2015, 07:18 AM   #22
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

Right on. If there is one thing Ive learned is that keeping it simple is the only way I can get a good mix. I occasionally read all these crazy production techniques and think about all the great sounding music recorded before we could do any of it and wonder if just because we can do something means we should do it.

And yes. Generally, people on forums want to argue about anything possible. I get caught up in it sometimes too. It is easy to be an asshat comfy behind the screen..

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Old 09-11-2015, 08:09 AM   #23
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

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Right on. If there is one thing Ive learned is that keeping it simple is the only way I can get a good mix. I occasionally read all these crazy production techniques and think about all the great sounding music recorded before we could do any of it and wonder if just because we can do something means we should do it.
Yeah, that's the kind of thinking that is productive. Saying I should use "process or technique x" because I read about it is like saying I should set my compressor to a ratio of 4:1, attack of 10ms and threshold of -6dB for my bass line because I read a tutorial and it said that these are the compression settings you should use to get "pro bass".

Nine times out of ten, if you have a choice between a solution that involves a single route versus multiple routes, the single route option is going to be superior. Superior in the sense that you have double the control (well n times the control where n is the number of routes) over all aspects of the signal. As soon as you have two signal paths, you have double the shit to deal with. Superior in the sense that you get more done for less work. And superior in the sense that you probably don't need to know too much to get a semi-decent sound coming out of one track.

For most people, particularly as a project develops, it's far more likely that the majority of the problems in their mixes are due to some convoluted process they have in place, like parallel compression, that they've made use of without really answering the question: Why?

Like every single time I've been asked to "clean up a mix" for someone, the first step involves detangling all of these messy signal routes that they've implemented for "creative reasons". Like one track I mixed was great but it sounded shit. The guy left it with me for a day and came back and told me it sounded ten times better with what I'd done. He thought I was a genius, so I didn't have the heart to tell him that all I'd done was killed all of his routes, chained his effects and turned off all of his multi-band compression... And it did. It sounded phenomenally better... and technically I didn't actually do anything other than hit a few off switches, copied and pasted some effects and deleted the clutter (oh and named the tracks and their regions).

And again, I'm not telling anyone what to do. I'm telling them to think about what they do. People can do whatever they want with their "art". If people don't care about good production values that's their prerogative.

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And yes. Generally, people on forums want to argue about anything possible. I get caught up in it sometimes too. It is easy to be an asshat comfy behind the screen..
Man, the only time brb replies to me it's to lob insults, call me names and disagree with what I said. I honestly don't get it. And I would much rather if he actually thought about what he was saying and made a cogent argument that contributed to, instead of derailing, the thread... But every time he just fires off at me like a lunatic. I just don't get it.

I mean, I don't even get how suggesting to "think about something" or asking someone to explain their ideas is so controversial. But obviously being sensible hits a nerve with brb
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Old 09-11-2015, 02:59 PM   #24
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

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Right on. If there is one thing Ive learned is that keeping it simple is the only way I can get a good mix. I occasionally read all these crazy production techniques and think about all the great sounding music recorded before we could do any of it and wonder if just because we can do something means we should do it.
Its just tricks up your sleeve to pull out when you want a particular effect/color to a sound. The more tools you have... Yeah music was good before but it does not sound the same as today. To make some off the modern stuff you will need those vocoders, auto tune and other techniques if you want to get the same sound. could/should? it is the artists choice. Different techniques gives different results. Different work flows different sounds. Cool that or remixes and remakes would be really boring.

In regards to the parallel comp discussion.

Yes if you have parallel and keep signal at 100% on the two channels will add up to a higher volume total. So you gotta adjust your outputs from the two channels accordingly.

As for what effects to use on parallel comp it depends what you want. But when I do it standard is to squash the signal pretty hard, remove the low end and bring out the mid/upper freq area. It works on sampled breaks and it works on one shot arrangements. I aim to add a sizzley, noisy layer to the drums that lies under the original I like that effect sometimes. You can degrade this signal more with distortion etc if you want a more dirty layer in your drums. I find this approach especially nice to get a more old school feeling to DnB drums.

Seeing how most people mix these days I do not think NY comp is that common anymore. NY became all the shit over the internet in the DnB and HipHop era that everyone wanted to produce 15 or so years ago. Today its more about EDM, electro and singer songwriter. As I see it NY comp is useful for a certain result but it is not the answer to shitty drums, its just icing on the cake for well made drums to add a little bit more and it only suits some styles. The drum hits in a lot of music these days are more individual hits then a unified layer. If you want a feeling of sampled break, drums as a unit, then play around with sending them together to comp and parallel comp and shit. But if you want this clean big sound you should work on the individual hits rather then the drum send as a whole.

Last edited by Crude_beats; 09-11-2015 at 03:13 PM..
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Old 09-11-2015, 04:59 PM   #25
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

Jaded, you'd be surprised how little I consider you. I'm sorry if If you feel that I'm singling you out for saying dumb things and pretending to be clever, but it's not just you. You're just one in a long line of pseuds. At some point it will be your turn again, but there will be other manchildren upset between now and then, none of whom I''m singling out.

I took issue with your argument, which was ostensibly factual. You failed to justify your claims, or even answer my questions directly, choosing instead to take diversions and make personal attacks. I'm happy that in doing so you conceded or avoided every point I made, choosing instead to just start belittling and slandering me to other people. Nothing says 'I'm confident in my argument' like avoiding challenges, whining, crying to other people, and being upset on the internet. I'll let you have the last word and see you next time I notice you saying something that's obviously bollocks. 0/

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Old 11-11-2015, 10:36 AM   #26
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

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I took issue with your argument, which was ostensibly factual. You failed to justify your claims, or even answer my questions directly, choosing instead to take diversions and make personal attacks.
Oh dear oh dear.

What is there left for me to justify? Your position is that I'm an idiot because I suggest that you should probably avoid using convoluted, complicated techniques which are probably unnecessary to achieve a desired result. I've asked anybody to give me a real world example of where parallel compression is their go-to, quick and dirty solution to achieve a result. So far, the only point you've made is "Jaded is a dick".

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I'm happy that in doing so you conceded or avoided every point I made, choosing instead to just start belittling and slandering me to other people.
What have I conceded dude? How have I belittled you? And slander? Bro, it's not slander if it's true.

I asked you for one real world example that you use in your process. I pointed out that you avoided providing one. I lamented that it would be much nicer if you invested your energy in expressing something related to parallel processing instead of dedicating your energy at having a go.

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Nothing says 'I'm confident in my argument' like avoiding challenges, whining, crying to other people, and being upset on the internet.
That's right. You're so confident in your argument that the only thing you have to say about it is pull some random figures out of your arse and say "Jaded is a dick". I have to say, now that I know I'm a dick, I am 100% convinced that I should use parallel compression at every step in my signal chain. Bravo.

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I'll let you have the last word and see you next time I notice you saying something that's obviously bollocks. 0/
Well, considering how many words you've already used to say nothing, I don't see how you could make it any other way.
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Old 11-11-2015, 10:55 PM   #27
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

Whoah… this thread exploded… haha…

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EDIT: haha… oops - it's a bit abstract… it didn't show the spaces…. Still looks remarkably like me though...

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Old 12-11-2015, 03:36 AM   #28
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Re: Does it make more creative options to link effects plugins in parallel?

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