Composition workflow, what processes work for you.
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Old 14-03-2014, 04:38 PM   #1
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Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

The past few weeks I have discovered a better workflow for me when it comes to composing. Usually I write a great melody and then I get stuck on how to proceed.

1. Figure out a simple beat, paste it into the entire estimated length of the song.
2. Section off 8 bars work on a lead.
3. Develop countermelody/backing/chorus for my lead.
4. Go back and modify and diversify percussion.
5. Cut and past melody sections and backing into song, allowing for breaks here and there.
6. Start adding other instruments, guitar, bass, sounds.
7. Continue to edit and diversify parts as needed.
8. Take breaks throughout the process to give ears a rest from the sounds and melody.
9. Start adding in audio samples, effects, and automation edits.
10. Continue to modify and make the sounds tighter, mixed, editing.

The biggest thing that helped was going in with the mindset...this will work now as a place holder, you can always edit later. Also I really hate hearing a click track when I'm recording...so having a basic beat to keep rhythm helps!

Share your workflow that works for you...

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Old 14-03-2014, 06:02 PM   #2
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Funny. I have settled almost exactly into the same workflow as you. The only thing that seems really different is I usually write the bass and melody w/o a beat or click track and typically start with those.

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Old 14-03-2014, 06:14 PM   #3
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

I write left to right. Start with the intro then progress the track from there, making notes on paper along the way as I've said before. I mix as I go but only to keep it out of the red. Then i take everything to audio, so as to record compressor activity, so when I then select all tracks and drop the faders about 5 db or so, things behaving based upon amplititue remain unaffected. Then comes minor level tweaking, transition smoothing, and glitching. All along the way I reference on multiple systems with the goal being, by the end, there's a natural balance when listening on the cans, in the car, and on the lappy.

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Old 14-03-2014, 06:37 PM   #4
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Icon6 Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muse-ic View Post
The past few weeks I have discovered a better workflow for me when it comes to composing. Usually I write a great melody and then I get stuck on how to proceed.

1. Figure out a simple beat, paste it into the entire estimated length of the song.
2. Section off 8 bars work on a lead.
3. Develop countermelody/backing/chorus for my lead.
4. Go back and modify and diversify percussion.
5. Cut and past melody sections and backing into song, allowing for breaks here and there.
6. Start adding other instruments, guitar, bass, sounds.
7. Continue to edit and diversify parts as needed.
8. Take breaks throughout the process to give ears a rest from the sounds and melody.
9. Start adding in audio samples, effects, and automation edits.
10. Continue to modify and make the sounds tighter, mixed, editing.

The biggest thing that helped was going in with the mindset...this will work now as a place holder, you can always edit later. Also I really hate hearing a click track when I'm recording...so having a basic beat to keep rhythm helps!

Share your workflow that works for you...
Wierd, that's almost exactly how I used to work back when I was kicking out tons of tunes.

Lately I dropped into a different workflow because I'm trying different DAWs out. It's definately not better because it's slower, but here's what it is not necessarily in this order!!!...

1) Noodle around in a DAW until I hit a roadblock while learning how it works. Save something.
2) Read some DAW manuals and repeat one or open up a different DAW when I hit a roadblock. Save something in the new DAW.
3) Do something random like sorting and fixing up presets.
4) Try to figure out better workflow for each DAW program
5) Make notes on paper
6) Spend endless time on forums. Reading and posting stuff like this

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Old 14-03-2014, 06:47 PM   #5
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

i have so much unfinished shit at this point that i dont start from scratch very often, and when i do i usually have a strong idea about to do, arrangement wise, melody ect ..

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Old 14-03-2014, 09:52 PM   #6
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

90 percent of the time (with my ambient/electronic stuff) it's an initial melody, then blossoms from there. in fact on the Tide stuff, you can hear that initial melody at the beginning of each song . That's just the nature of that project though, and I just work off of that initial part, doodle with the melody to make some changes, write a bassline to it, make some extra chords that I'll usually push out to the side (literally, in the daw) until I think it needs them. Takes forever ftmp.

with my rocking metal jams it's always a guitar and drums. One might get going before the other, but it's always those two things.

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Old 14-03-2014, 10:31 PM   #7
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

I once tried to make a generic "workflow" hoping it would work as an algorithm that never fails to make a song, but sadly my creative process does not work in a linear way. My mind works best in parallel, having lots of threads to sew together at the same time.

I find that the most important aspects of the process is to actually have an idea of what you want to make, and to always know what the next step is.

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Old 14-03-2014, 11:23 PM   #8
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

My workflow is usually always the same. It might vary in which part I start with (drums, bass, lead, etc.), but I usually build everything in a 16-bar loop or so, then start sequencing it and adding things as I go.

Usually I start with a chord progression or a beat. Occasionally I'll start with a bassline or lead but that's more rare. I like to have the backdrop/foundation laid before working on those elements.
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Old 14-03-2014, 11:45 PM   #9
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Most of my time spent in the DAW is just experimentation with no intention of making a track. (I do bounce things a lot to get loops though and save effects chains/instruments/drum kits etc). I just have this one project file that is in constant progression. When it gets messy, I bounce the bits I want and then delete the lot. I love working like this without the pressure of making a track because I can just go down the rabbit hole with chaining and routing things to other things like "what happens If I put an LFO on this parameter then modulate the freq and amp of that LFO by another LFO which is re triggered by the signal from some hi hat patterns etc?"

Granted, this does get a bit daft at times but it is these processes that keep my mind open to ways of creating and what is possible. Also, when I feel like I want to make a track, I am never short of source material and the writing can flow more easily.

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Old 15-03-2014, 12:59 AM   #10
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Personally I've learned a few things in the past couple months that have really helped to increase my workflow, and enabled my time in the studio to be quick and easy...

Studio -
I made sure to set up the studio so that i can just go in, plug the laptop in and boom I'm ready (I even have lamps set on a remote to turn on hah). All of my controllers that I use are plugged in (even if I don't use them all the time, the relevant ones are there.. I mainly use a full sized set of keys, DAW controller, MPD and a launchpad.

Templates and FXChains -
I used to hate the idea but using them now I realise how much time I save. My basic template has all of my standard returns setup (rev, delay, distortion, subgroups) I delete these if I don't find myself using them to save CPU. Each of them have a compressor set up on them with sidechaining if needed, and then each subgroup has an FX chain of standard needs (Comp, Sidechain, EQ, Limiter etc etc) with macros set to the main things I adjust.

Presets -
Again, I didn't want to do this originally, but now that I've made a library of my own presets, and drag stuff in if I like the sound of them, it's really helped to create my own sound. I found that if I was opening up a synth from scratch I was generally plumbing in the same sound anyway, so having my own presets makes things a lot easier, and means I can really work on the music. This doesn't stop me from opening something up from scratch though.

Tracks -
I'll generally have a track for drums, then break that down into kick, snare, cymbals and percussion. I'll then have a track for sub, then bass, chords/pads, leads, then sweeps and air. Add/take away as needed.

Writing the Music -
I start off with 4-16 bars of anything really. Maybe a chord progression, melody, or slicing/chopping samples. If I start off with drums I'll find that I have to go back to adjust them to the melody/bass parts anyway, so they're left until I've gotten something solid down so that they don't feel static or robotic. This helps them to glue with the music rather than just stick out like a sore thumb.

Sweeps, air and texture are added in after I've structured the track so that I know where to place them. I'll also then add in automation for variation, and finally do a good mix/EQ of everything needed. (Sidechaining and compression is done througout writing the music)
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Old 15-03-2014, 01:05 AM   #11
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

^^^ Nice.

I tend to be an anarchist. To rules, schedules anythings.

I make plans and write out things to do for myself and I ALWAYS rebel when it comes time. I am really just naturally a creative vibe person who goes with the flow at the moment when I'm feeling something.

This creates issues though, because I need to work, sleep, get stuff done.

I have found that having a flexible workflow, one that can be changed, but a few basic steps helps keep me organized and focused on goals.
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Old 15-03-2014, 01:07 AM   #12
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banaan View Post

I find that the most important aspects of the process is to actually have an idea of what you want to make, and to always know what the next step is.
Sitting down and opening a blank synth patch with no ideas can be interesting, but lately I have been all about having some kind of goal and being focused on meeting it.

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Old 15-03-2014, 01:13 AM   #13
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

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Originally Posted by relic View Post
Sitting down and opening a blank synth patch with no ideas can be interesting, but lately I have been all about having some kind of goal and being focused on meeting it.
Exacly...I can't tell you how many hours I spent lost in doing stuff like that. Now I feel as if I just want to complete projects and have finished projects. Something to show for the time spent.

Also I find that completing a track forces you to new places and you learn new things as a big picture type of thing, where just little hours of fiddling don't go there as much.
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Old 15-03-2014, 01:36 AM   #14
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Yes. I found recently that I have been abandoning most tunes just at the point where I would have to really push my abilities to take the track further and really finish them. I think it was a subconscious thing, I would never really have to test my skills, I could just start a new tune and get my jollies from working with a new idea rather than really pushing myself and the sounds.

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Old 15-03-2014, 02:45 AM   #15
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Sometimes its just worth the effort though. Lately i feel most of the time its not worth the effort, but maybe ill put a clip up and then somebody ends up liking it giving me motivation to plod on.

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Old 15-03-2014, 05:32 PM   #16
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

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Originally Posted by RFJ View Post
Then i take everything to audio, so as to record compressor activity, so when I then select all tracks and drop the faders about 5 db or so, things behaving based upon amplititue remain unaffected. Then comes minor level tweaking, transition smoothing, and glitching. All along the way I reference on multiple systems with the goal being, by the end, there's a natural balance when listening on the cans, in the car, and on the lappy.
It's never crossed my mind to do this, I avoid red-lining as I go but often find I still need to pull everything down a few dB before rendering. This is a really useful tip. Thanks

Also referencing on cans/hifi etc along the way is a really good way to improve workflow. It means you don't have to keep running back to your mix when you've bounced everything out.
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Old 15-03-2014, 07:02 PM   #17
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

I used to always start with an intro that would be lasting for a minute or something, having it so complex that I would have troubles with finishing the track.

What I have found working for me is
1) Starting a new project
2) Making a loop (I am not a huge bass fan, so it is usually a drum loop or chord progression)
3) Layering some of the parts with different patches, modulating effects, until the point I am completely satisfied with the results, or any adjustments do only harm.
4) Making some variations, whether it would be rhythmic or note changes, chord inversions or effect modulations
5) Saving the project.

This way helps me to get concentrated on the particular time selection, and the variety of loops exported does not do any harm to my artistic flow.

It might not be the proper way to make music, though I could not really do any electronic tunes, until I decided to change my traditional pop-rock-whatever view of songwriting to idk, maybe to DJ sense of the things going...
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:34 PM   #18
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Are any of you using Ableton's session view for composition?
I'm new to Ableton and I find Session view great for quickly getting some ideas out, recombine them and play around with stuff...
But in terms of recording this jamming into an actual track, that's not really working very well for me.
Anyone working along those lines?

Cheers!
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:20 AM   #19
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VoidPointer View Post
Are any of you using Ableton's session view for composition?
I'm new to Ableton and I find Session view great for quickly getting some ideas out, recombine them and play around with stuff...
But in terms of recording this jamming into an actual track, that's not really working very well for me.
Anyone working along those lines?

Cheers!
Took me a while to get into composing like this and for me it only works for some songs.
but it really does add some serious fun into making the track, not that I lack any excitment normally.
Just get use to make small loops and mess aorund with how progression A sounds well with Beat C and Melody K. Sometimes for me the suprises really get the track going.
But my general work flow is a lot like 5th spear's. I have everything read to go so nothing can get in the way.

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Old 03-04-2014, 07:32 AM   #20
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Re: Composition workflow, what processes work for you.

Yeh session view can be great for getting ideas down...

I can't remember who it was by but my general 'compositional' workflow starts off I'm session view.

I'll start off with an 8/16 bar loop, add layers, then copy these into arrangement. Paste them into arrangement view, then copy and past them around, adjust individual parts, add variety etc and then add extra automation.

Ideally you want a few differnt 'scenes' in session to transfer across (different sections) to avoid things getting repatative.

If you want to 'jam out' in session and record in arrangement, this can be quite fun, but you often need dedicated controllers with a lot of parameters mapped out to make things flexible.

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